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Shmups and Bullet Hell Thread Anonymous 06/01/2022 (Wed) 15:59:04 No.2808
Any of you lads been playing any shmups lately? I've mostly been playing Blue Revolver and DonPachi, although I'm not particularly good at either (or shmups in general) yet. Speaking of Blue Revolver, is it just me or is there something a little off about the stages and patterns? I've heard DonPachi isn't anywhere near as good as its sequels or many other shmups, but somehow the levels and enemy encounters seem...better paced? I'm not sure I can put my finger on what it is mechanically. Stage aesthetics is another story: DonPachi's stages feel like you're moving through locations with distinct areas and purposes while Blue Revolver's seem arbitrary, as though you're going over a themed assortment of tilesets and scrolling backgrounds instead of actually attacking a mountain convoy or shooting up the docks. I get it, Blue Revolver has a much smaller team than a Cave shmup, but when the programmer makes remarks like "The creeping sensation that I earned none of the modest success this game achieved, and that just around the corner the game will be found out as just a bunch of PNGs moving on a screen" and "I became convinced that in terms of the game/level/pattern design, I had completely pulled a fast one on STG fans the world over and just barely got away with it," I hate to say it, but on some level I get what the guy means. You really begin to notice this stuff after playing the same stages over and over. Hopefully Double Action fixes some of this. The patterns shown in the (years old) trailer look good and I like the new UI, shit, the recoloured backgrounds are an improvement as well, but I'm not sure my complaints can be fixed without significant changes to the backgrounds or stage layouts in general. Anyhow, here's a couple freetard shmups you may or may not have heard of: http://olofson.net/kobodl/ - Enhanced version of XKobo, a Japanese freetard shmup about blowing up space bases http://garden.sourceforge.net/ - Not the biggest fan of this one, it's fairly slow and doesn't always distinguish enemies from the stage background very well https://chromium-bsu.sourceforge.io/ - Freetard shmup balanced around fucking mouse controls, I think it goes on forever https://smcameron.github.io/wordwarvi/ - Editor war shmup, haven't tried it yet https://linux.tlk.fr/games/Powermanga/ - Looks cute, haven't tried it yet
I've never been one for shmups but then I really liked the Cotton series. It's not just the games themselves but also the the look and the setting that I likes. In general I prefer the 16-bit pseudo-3D shmups although there aren't that many of those sadly.
>I've heard DonPachi isn't anywhere near as good as its sequels or many other shmups People damn donpachi with faint praise because DDP is probably the most popular choice for 'best shmup of all time', followed by DDP:DOJ. I don't think anyone thinks it's badly made, just that the sequels aren't obeisant to technical limitations or the mindset surrounding such. Also, the DDP sequels sound incredibly nice but that's just my bias. I desperately need to get back into shmups. I've been wasting time on fighting games and I should start plugging rounds into DOJ or DFK or something and try to clear for best girl again. This isn't really a shmup concept but the shot selection/redbar for difficulty in DFK 1.5 black is probably the best version of difficulty settings I've ever seen in a videogame, ever. You immediately feel like a badass on the lower shot types where you're outrageously powerful but since the stage is actually built for it it's great, and 2loops were always a time waster that should have split into proper difficulty settings (or seperate games) a long time ago imo. >garden I have this game burnt into my subconscious because it's one of the only real videogames on the debian stable package list. Whenever I hear similar soundtracks in games I think instantly of GoL.
>>2811 >Whenever I hear similar soundtracks in games I think instantly of GoL. what's it like?
i wish the genre didn't die and we could see shmups with modern grafix
>>2813 Play it and find out. I'm thinking especially of the first stage which is most heavily dependent on the sound of enemies firing and I don't think there's a video of a pacifist run anywhere.
>>2824 >I don't think there's a video of a pacifist run anywhere How is this possible?
>>2828 There are like two 14yr old videos of the demo and one 12yr old full clear on youtube. It's simply not a well known game and it predates people habitually recording things. It's not like it has an active high scoring scene or anything.
>>2829 japs have the vids of most obscurest of games
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>>2816 Closest I can think of to STGs with modern graphics are western indie games like Pawarumi, although I have no idea if they're any good. Speaking of western shmups, one that people don't seem to shut up about is Zeroranger. Its premise and the constant comparisons to Undertale make it sound a bit pretentious,, but is it at least a decent shmup?
>>2854 >Pawarumi I wouldn't call it 'modern graphics', though modern-made it looks like a PS2 game in high res, which is understandable for an indie game but a far cry from what one would expect out of a modern game. But that is the curse of indieshit to never rise above retro regurgitation, intentional or not. > I have no idea if they're any good It's alright for what it is. >Zeroranger Eh, it's a mediocre western indie pixelshit shmup. Otherwise it tries to be a fake japanese game which is cringy as fuck.
why do you think shmups died?
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>>2855 >Eh, it's a mediocre western indie pixelshit shmup. Otherwise it tries to be a fake japanese game which is cringy as fuck. Kind of what I expected, sadly. There's something distinctly unappealing about this new kind of weebshit. It lacks the charm of westerners trying and failing to imitate Japanese media, and both it and its fans come across as though they feel their work is superior to their source material. They're obviously drawn to Japanese media, but cannot fully embrace it, nor do they have the sensitivity needed to channel its subtler qualities. Thus they end up taking a superficial impression of Japanese media and injecting it with "depth" rather than truly engaging with the tradition.
>>2861 Yeah, there's been a notable rise in counterfeiting jap media in recent years. It's one thing to be inspired by jap stuff and aesthetics but they autistically try to make jap stuff, without understanding anything about it. And since they're all limited to western reddit mindset and are libshit soyjacks to boot, the end result is truly horrific.
>>2860 By the time 3D gaming really kicked off, traditional 2D shmups felt incredibly dull and dated. There were a lot of generic 3D and FMV-based shmups, but most of them were bargain bin rubbish.
>>2863 But that applies to nearly everything. Surely a few big named franchises could have survived. And also there were a lot of quality shmups, both 2D and 3D, on PS2. It seems that like with most everything, things went tits after the 6th gen. 7th gen was so preoccupied with the newly found "realism" identity that it rejected an entire sway of genres that couldn't fit into that new vision of the medium.
>>2860 Shmups aren't dead
>>2871 they are tho
>>2871 Based on what?
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I heard Ketsui was good, but man, did it ever catch me off-guard. It's beautiful. I don't know shit about its scoring system or anything like that, shit, I'm not even very good at these games yet, all I know is that the bullet patterns are fucking beautiful and a joy to dodge and that the music is great.
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>>2931 Mein negro. Ketsui is excellent. Which version did you play?
>>2933 I got the ROM off the FC2 JSON pack, so it's the Arcade version's second revision. Somewhat related, but is there any particular reason why only three of Cave's shooters were ported to PC?
>>2934 >the Arcade version's second revision. Ah, the best version then. >is there any particular reason why only three of Cave's shooters were ported to PC? Very few Jap games get ported to PC in general, niche stuff especially so. Even m*bile ports are more common; which by the way Ketsui has.
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Obligatory shilling for Hellsinker and Radio Zonde. Only casuals use Minogane.
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>>2936 Both are great. Though a bit too hard for me tbh. You either spend weeks git guding or don't even try.
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>>2937 Hellsinker is definitely easier than RZ but also a lot more polished.
>>2950 >>2937 Also fun fact: The Apostles of the Seed are implied to be Yoxola and Mahilo judging from their attacks.
>>2951 Yeah I liked the lore a lot.
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>>2952 >ミステルトゥとのより深い依存と共生関係。 別の生き物を半ば生めこまれる形で、彼女は全てを得た。  歓喜! 身を覆う予防衣の肌触り、消毒薬のどこかすえた匂い、静寂の中響く金属同士が擦れ合う音、そして蛍光灯の青ざめた眩しさ。  ミステルトゥを通し、眼前に映る全ては新しい世界。古ぼけた灰色の世界を完全に彼方に追いやる、彼女にとっての真実であった。  ――それが人を遥かに越えるものであって、彼女の求めた世界との隔たりは何ら変わっていない事になど気づく筈も無く―― Yeah it's pretty good.
>>2954 >歓喜! 身を覆う予防衣の肌触り、消毒薬のどこかすえた匂い、静寂の中響く金属同士が擦れ合う音、そして蛍光灯の青ざめた眩しさ。
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What is your opinion on Ikaruga? It's not my cup of tea, but now that I'm a little better at shmups it's easier to appreciate it as a puzzle game.
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>>3009 >What is your opinion on Ikaruga? I mean, it's legendary and pretty much a synonym for shmups for a reason. Hard to imagine more of a "shmups the game". I guess you can say it's just Radiant Silvergun 2 but the name doesn't really roll off your tongue like Ikaruga.
ikaruga > gradius
>>3013 Galaga > Ikaruga
>>3011 >the gimmickest of gimmick shmups >'shmups the game'
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>>3048 >the gimmickest of gimmick shmups like its a bad thing
>get my first 1CC >Blue Wish Resurrection Plus on Heaven mode >only played it on a whim this night I recall this being easy (even with the very forgiving autobomb), but not this easy. Still pretty fun though, I like the bullet patterns even if they're slow, but I guess I should move up to Original or Hell if I want to progress.
>>3059 >Blue Wish Resurrection Plus Never heard of it. Is it gud?
>sober up a little >realise I shouldn't brag about 1CCing a babby shmup on its easiest difficulty A while before sobering up, I did make a stab at its Original difficulty, and even if my brain shut off for the night during the third boss and I ultimately lost during the fourth, I'm pretty confident I could 1CC Original shortly. Don't know about Hell though, as I haven't tried it or messed around with the other ships, and playing it with all slowdown disabled is absolutely out of the question for a long time. >>3061 If you don't mind it being on the easier side, yes, absolutely. Years ago someone recommended it to me as a great beginner's bullet hell, which turns out to be a common take and one that makes a lot of sense. Its lowest difficulty (Heaven) has fairly slow but still pleasing patterns, good pacing, and excellent use of slowdown during really heavy moments, while Original ups both the pattern speed and density a decent amount and Hell likely does so even more. It's also fairly configurable, letting you disable slowdown or autobombing (I'll definitely do this if I play Heaven again, since I need to get a better feel for bombing) or even speed up the overall bullet speed without increasing the overall game speed. You do have to enable a 60fps cap if you play on a high refresh rate monitor though, and the visuals and audio aren't amazing. If it isn't obvious, I'd definitely recommend it. It's a freeware doujin game and, at the very least, should give you a fun couple minutes and a bit more if you decide to 1CC it on Original or Hell. I've heard the dev's other freeware shmups are good too, and back in November the guy released his first paid game on Steam after 8 or so years of development. I wish he'd released it elsewhere too, but I've had a lot of fun with this so I may toss him a couple bucks once I'm a little better at BWRP.
>>3063 Interesting, I need to check it out.
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>>2813 Here's a good example of what >>2824 means: https://yewtu.be/watch?v=dFLPxuA4JaM . The first stage has a simple backing track with enemies layering notes above it as they fire at you. It doesn't sound amazing, no, but, like the rest of the game, it is pretty distinct.
>>3155 Very distinct indeed. Pretty cool, though I don't know if I could listen to it hours on end.
>>3155 looks like a flash game tbh
Does this thing say "humanity dies with you" or am I going nuts?
>>3201 you mean in-game?
>>3202 Yes
>>3011 >>3048 Ikaruga is a puzzle game.
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>take a break from shmups >play Blue Revolver while sick and sleep-deprived >reach the stage 4 boss for the first time and get a good ways into it I may still suck at these by a shmup veteran's standards, but man, does it ever feel good to get better.
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>>3336 >don't touch the game for over a week >figure I'll experiment with a different shot type granted, I did dump most of my special weapon ammo on certain phases >clear the penultimate boss on my first try >get a good ways into the final stage and past its first miniboss
>>3346 >reach the final boss using Val's variable shot >reach the boss' final stage >its HP doesn't deplete nearly as fast as the other stages >really regret picking the arc caster >die as I defeat the boss
>>3336 >>3346 >>3373 Drop Vidya, and accept Jesus Christ as your lord and saviour.
>>3374 play vidya that glorifies Christ.
>>3375 ANATHEMA HERETIC CUNT
>>3374 Take your pills
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>>3374 Sad bait, plus I'm already Christian.
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Aesthetically or mechanically, what is the strangest shmup you've ever played?
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>GOG announces a Bullet Hell sale >almost none of the games are shmups >the shmups present are ones no one describes as bullet hell >fucking Sine Mora in the sale I'm sick of bullet hell being a label indieshits steal for their non-shmup games. It's like these people saw one video of a Touhou boss, thought "duuude, how do people even play this," then slap the most basic bitch bullet patterns into generic action roguelite #4633 and pollute the genre's search results.

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