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Controllers Anonymous 04/30/2022 (Sat) 13:12:58 No.2339
What is anon's favorite controller? What do you think about pressure sensitive buttons and vibration? Also, how do you store your controllers? I'm trying to collect usb gamepads to emulate games in an authentic manner but storing them is definitely a hassle. I had to go and buy craft paper, and make myself boxes to house them (pic related). Though it only works with small oldschool gamepads but maybe I'll try making boxes for large ones as well, at least you can easily stack them that way.
>>2339 >What is anon's favorite controller? I've always been partial to the various DualShocks (PSX was my first system so no surprise there). In particular I like how the DS4 feels, very solid and nicely rounded. >What do you think about pressure sensitive buttons An interesting feature though in games like Gran Turismo I tend to over-press to ensure full speed which does get a bit sore after a while. >and vibration? When used right it can add some immersion, though if it's drawing lots of attention to itself then the game probably has a bad implementation. >Also, how do you store your controllers? On a shelf, which works no problem for wireless and fortunately I'm not overrun with wired controllers. Those boxes are a cool solution though anon, nice one.
>>2340 Dualshock to me, and I'm also biased here, is like the default controller and everything else after it is either a variation on it or purposefully trying to not be it, usually with diminishing returns. >When used right it can add some immersion, though if it's drawing lots of attention to itself then the game probably has a bad implementation. The problem with vibration I find is that in 99% of cases it's used just to vibrate violently when something explodes or clashes on the screen, usually in cutscenes. Only a small percentage of games uses it in interesting and creative ways, like MGS2 for example where it's linked to character's heartbeat, footsteps, interactable elements and so on. Nowadays I pretty much just turn it off before starting any game. >On a shelf, which works no problem for wireless Wireless controllers are also kinda pain in the ass in their own right, needing to recharge them constantly, especially after long periods of disuse. I'd rather find ways to organize wired controllers just so you could pick one up right away.
>>2342 >needing to recharge them constantly The one exception I've found is the Wii U Pro Controller. I think it's rated for 80 hours or something ridiculous? Even with several months between uses that thing still holds a charge. >I'd rather find ways to organize wired controllers There's various wall hooks that some people use, not sure how effective those are for wired though. A detachable cable would be pretty convenient if all your controllers use the same mini/micro USB port.
>>2343 >The one exception I've found is the Wii U Pro Controller Yeah but it probably costs a hefty sum and is it really worth it for Wii U... >There's various wall hooks that some people use Likely more pain in the ass than its worth. Ultimately some kind of container is the best solution. >A detachable cable would be pretty convenient if all your controllers use the same mini/micro USB port There are things like that but it's for modern stuff, chances of finding retro controllers with that get up are zero.
>>2345 >Yeah but it probably costs a hefty sum and is it really worth it for Wii U... The prices don't seem that bad actually from a quick look (which is surprising given that Wii U is a bit more pricey these days IIRC) although it does appear that China has done some faking so watch out for that. It should be possible to use with PC emulators, certainly on Linux that sort of thing is plug 'n' play but Windows might require a driver or something. Quite a good controller though it does lack analog triggers. >chances of finding retro controllers with that get up are zero Yeah it is weird that isn't more common place. It's the kind of thing that wouldn't be very hard to do as a mod actually, people do that sort of thing with headphones all the time.
>>2346 >It's the kind of thing that wouldn't be very hard to do as a mod actually But you'd have to pay for it. Likely more than for the actual controller. A classic usb controller is around 6 bucks and I doubt the mod would be as cheap.
>>2348 6 dollars? What are they like? Surely the build quality must be pretty compromised?
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>>2349 Well, you don't need anything complex for a NES or SNES usb gamepad so they're pretty alright. You can pay extra to get one build from the exact same materials as the real original gamepad but it's whatever, in the end you don't feel any difference and they play the same anyway. Starting with 32 bits and onward you definitely don't want to buy something too cheap though since the innards complexity went up a few notches. You can still find something cheap that works alright, what I would do is get a busted real controller and use its buttons and interchangeable innards in the usb one. So you end up with something more sturdy and authentic feeling.
>What is anon's favorite controller? Modern one maybe the Xbox One controller although i still dislike its D-Pad, i've heard the second Pimped Up version fixed some of its d-pad problems along with other ones that the first version introduced. Traditional (non-dual stick) one i would say either the second Sega Saturn pad or the Mad Catz SFIV pad for Xbox 360 >Mad Catz It's very comfortable, i don't know if good but every button is snappy (maybe the shoulders not so much but they work) and the D-Pad moves as fluid if a bit more soft than the Saturn's. >how do you store your controllers? Bend the cable way above the union with the controller's spine and then wrap them in chinese spiral, inside a dry wood cabinet i had for clothes. If i use it too much i just put them above the console who goes inside another cabinet i had for underwear and assorted things. >What do you think about pressure sensitive buttons and vibration? Pressure buttons are welcome but some only worked partially, not well employed and/or busted after a time. While i highly enjoy pressure triggers like the Xbox One ones (no spring so it doesn't screech after heavy use like the 360's or fuck the motherboard up like the PS4 one) i have to say i didn't like the PS2 button version of it, i think it was O? MGS3 used it but it was trashy because you needed a good pad, if you had one used a bit too much you would cut the throat of people rather than interrogate them. Some games like GTA San Andreas and Gran Turismos also used it for throttle and you usually went from 0 to full on if the button felt like it. In this regard the Xbox controller, any of them, was superior in the long run. Vibration in my opinion is almost a most, feedback from it is very comfortable and something i miss dearly when playing PC but some games support it even if used as a pad as the control uses its own battery to rumble the handles. Some games, usually sports ones, use vibration often as target feedbacks, for example in split screen rather than showing the crosshairs or pointer your controller would softly rattle to confirm a zero/center so as to make your opponent next to you not see where you are pointing although sometimes you could hear it. List goes on but sadly many games have used the visual interface as to confirm something, infamously GTA V and some shooter games put visual interferences as feedback (briefly defocus, shake it and/or puts a black and white filter) for having killed or blowed up something rather than a soft rattle, makes the entire visual experiences more jumbled than it needs to be, also pretty tiring after a while but some people love it. I know it's a tired commentary but i fucking hate how controllers are collectables too, damn Hori controllers are getting pricey and very few have made new ones, 3D printing supposedly would alleviate this but it hasn't. I want my Hori 64 mini pad and not pay car engine parts money for it.
>>2353 >i didn't like the PS2 button version of it, i think it was O? MGS3 used it but it was trashy because you needed a good pad, if you had one used a bit too much you would cut the throat of people rather than interrogate them. >Some games like GTA San Andreas and Gran Turismos also used it for throttle and you usually went from 0 to full on if the button felt like it. In this regard the Xbox controller, any of them, was superior in the long run. You sure you didn't have a chinese bootleg controller? DualShock 2 introduced the function and worked flawlessly. I had one for over a decade and it remained pretty much like brand new, not a single button or stick got loose and the sensitivity was always spot on. That is the authentic Japanese quality.
>>2354 >You sure you didn't have a chinese bootleg controller? I had/have 3 DS2 and only one works properly, the other 2 are serviced and original but you cannot fix the O without spare parts and that practically costs the same as the controller (12 bucks). >worked flawlessly It worked but let's not kid ourselves, its travel distance wasn't good for racing games where you need 3 or 4 spaces (full throttle, cornering fast, cornering slow, revving) at most if you were very precise you could barely get 3 and not for a long time. It got the thumb nail pain too like anon said above. >That is the authentic Japanese quality. I wasn't lucky to buy one brand new, had to depend on used market and it's much easier to find full working OG Xbox controllers than DS2s by a good stretch. There is, you just have to test them extensively beforehand, which i didn't because i didn't stumble upon games that needed it after the buy. What i can say is that they are as sturdy, it's rare to find one with broken screws or corners like some Xbox ones due to their heavy build and long fragile screw compartments. PS3 ones are another story, the triggers are better than the PS4 ones but the thing is flimsy and the batteries bloat often. Every controller is build a little worse than the one before with the DS although i haven't tried the PS5 one aside from holding it, good triggers have to say.
>>2355 >I had/have 3 DS2 and only one works properly I dunno anon, unless you or the previous owner had them slammed into a wall or something. I've never seen real DualShocks with loose buttons, it's very much an issue of bootlegs. I had several DS2s since 2002 and neither had an issue with anything. DS2s are probably the sturdiest out of the family. >It worked but let's not kid ourselves, its travel distance wasn't good for racing games where you need 3 or 4 spaces I don't care for racing games so that's not really an issue for me but out of those vrooms that I did play I don't think there even were ones with 4 spaces, and it played just fine the way it was. So this seems like a very niche problem. Certainly for the predominant majority of games that's not an issue. >PS3 ones are another story, the triggers are better than the PS4 ones but the thing is flimsy and the batteries bloat often Yeah DS3 was a disaster with those R2/L2s, one careless move and you press them; even just trying to put the controller down may result in pressing them accidentally. Also fingers slip off them easily and then can also get stuck under them. What a trashfire design. >Every controller is build a little worse than the one before That I agree with, though I haven't touched DS4 because you know, no games, but it seems like it's an expensive gadget in its own right that you have to be careful with, while DS1-DS2s were just solid controllers you could smack across the room and have them work just fine afterwards.
>>2356 >unless the previous owner had them slammed into a wall or something That's the thing, i don't know if they did or not or if the controller was made out of spare parts. I just grabbed them because they looked aesthetically great; used parts perks and cons. Also i did word something weird, it is easier that OG Xbox are in better shape than DS2 ones if you find one, they are getting more rare by the day while DS2s are very easy to find in the open although they need checking, somewhat the same with the OG Sixaxis. >this seems like a very niche problem >racing games Are you sure? i can bet the predominant majority of the people who bought games had either at least one racing game or an action game that used the sensitive button for dual uses, for example the aforementioned MGS3. >but it seems like it's an expensive gadget in its own right I was very surprised initially with its implementation of the touch pad, nobody uses it but it is very, very durable for what it is and as sensitive as a laptop finger pad, very nice for not that high of a price but i was also disdained by the utter shit USB connection on top, it breaks easily and repairing it needs both soldering and a spare part. One cannot turn the lights out either and the triggers scratches the motherboard too, after a while it will wipe the connections to the start button IIRC, at least that's what our repairman said. New Xbox controllers also solder the potentiometer extra hard, they cannot be taken out without breaking something so if the stick starts to drift or has important dead zones then it means another controller if the one-year guarantee voids while not long ago the sticks could be replaced easily for higher quality stuff for 15 dollars. Planned obsolete lifespan is pure AIDS. I agree with the first PS1 controllers, very sturdy too and their D-Pad were ironically more snappy than the first DS1, don't know about the Dual Analog one (non-shock Dualshock/Dual Stick PS1 controller) as i don't recall seeing it in the wild or owning it.
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>>2370 > i can bet the predominant majority of the people who bought games had either at least one racing game For sure. But like I mentioned a lot of racing games don't even have that level of sensitivity, at least during DS2 days. So this is a niche problem. >action game that used the sensitive button for dual uses, for example the aforementioned MGS3 Now MGS3 I know in and out and it works flawlessly on a normal, not fucked up controller. >nobody uses it So it's sixaxis 2.0 basically. >New Xbox controllers also solder the potentiometer extra hard Oh yeah I remember the memes about it. Of course it is made so specifically that you couldn't fix it and had to buy a new one. All modern tech down to fridges and microwave is made extra poor for a lifespan of 5 years. Jews be jewin'.
>>2370 >the utter shit USB connection on top >the triggers scratches the motherboard too I wonder if these apply to V2 units, the DS4 had a second revision to address some build quality issues so that may not be the case on recent controllers. As for the touchpad the only game I can think of is Tearaway Unfolded, it also works okay on PSTV for games that require touch.
>>2380 The touch thing is a gimmick they just had to add, otherwise it's not gonna feel like some progression happened: DS1 - rumblepack DS2 - pressure buttons DS3 - sixaxis Can't just make a gamepad without a gimmick. But actually if you think about it, there's been almost like a parallel console war of gamepad gimmicks since the '90s.
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I heard that N64 joystick is actually pretty good despite its looks. Is this true?
>>2398 didn't it invent the vibration?
>>2411 Terrible legacy tbh.
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>>2398 For what it's worth the center handle is extremely comfy to hold with the Z-Button so well positioned it makes you wonder how life would be if they'd put a Gamecube-style trigger there. The stick when it works properly is perhaps the most precise ministick for platformers and arcade flying games ever made, both the surface grip and the stick's mechanical gears make it trivial to sneak past sleeping enemies in Banjo-Kazooie/Tooie which on RA with a modern pad usually requires sensitivity adjustments. Thanks to the unidirectional spring the stick's overall dexterity isn't hampered by the "high" sensitivity and can be moved around with little issue for regular gameplay, it's sad geared joysticks were abandoned in favor of gay potentiometers. Sadly the criticisms regarding the stick's reliability are also true, due to a deliberate? design flaw moving the stick gradually wears down some plastic that's partially responsible for centering and stabilizing the stick, unlike a modern thumbstick a N64 stick won't "drift" in a specific direction but rather become loose inside its growing deadzone, this flaw is inherent to every official N64 controller ever made. Aside from that the grip on the stick is also not very pleasant to use over a long time, it creates indents on your thumb and the ridges don't do a great job combating sweat buildup (which I suppose to be their intended function). It's not so bad for short sessions but can get rather unpleasant if you play for longer than half an hour. The rest of the controller isn't great either, while the center handle is almost perfect ergonomics wise the side handles are a mixed bag that were probably designed for Miyamoto's own hands and while functional feel reminiscent of a Taiwanese clone imported from Russia. The A and B buttons at least have very good placement and work as well as expected, but they can get slippery from sweat due to being a bit too flat and pressed at an angle. The C buttons on the other hand are just shit, no way around it. Their placement is plain bad with the right C button being hard to reach compared to the other buttons and the feel, ergonomics and actuation force are also shit, the buttons stick out and waggle which makes me wonder how many shekels Kiketendo spent on them. They're not an issue when used in a secondary role like the camera controls in M64, but you better hope the devs didn't map anything of immediate importance to the top and right C button when playing other games. The L and R button on the other hand have okay ergonomics and a somewhat uneven actuation force, it's not bad but I wonder why they used what appears to be a relatively hard switch compared to the A/B buttons. The d-pad however is the biggest fucking disappointment on this controller bar none. It's FUCKING HORRIBLE AAAAHHHH I WISH I'D HAD A THIRD PARTY PAD FOR PLAYING MISCHIEF MAKERS WITH AS A KID Now I may have gotten unlucky with the controllers I've owned in my life but having used SNES, NES, GB, GBA and DS dpads before every official N64 dpad I've had the misfortune of using not only had overly stiff switches that require high actuation force with little give yet also little feedback on when a direction is fully pressed down, and of course the switches wear out oddly fast giving you a spiritual thumbstick experience after some time. This is made even worse by the horrendous ergonomics, the dpad is again positioned at some angle but this time Nintendo didn't invest any effort into properly positioning it so if you enjoyed your thumb getting tired from being held at a weird angle you're in for a treat! Using the dpad also makes you realize how fast the switches on the L/R buttons wear down, granted they're far more robust than the joystick and will still work fine after years of use but since R is the only shoulder button you'll be able to use in 99% of N64 games it will wear out faster than L resulting in L being really stiff in the few games that do use the dpad, sometimes to the point dust/dirt get inside the gaps between the button and case which can jam the button when pressing it at certain angles. I'd rate it a 5/10, it has some good ideas but they clearly hadn't fully figured out how to do controllers for 3D games yet and the dpad+L button along with the left handle are deadweight for the majority of the N64 library.
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>>2511 Nice gamepad review anon.
>>2474 This shit was super dope in 1998. I wonder why they never tried with the removable mini-gamepad thing again.
>>2586 >I wonder why they never tried with the removable mini-gamepad thing again. prolly too expensive
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>>2586 The Dreamcast implementation with the VMU serving as a memory card would've been too expensive just look at how much of a shitshow the Wii U was but it's possible that Nintendo in an alternate early 2000s could've developed the concept further and designed the GBA to fit into a dedicated slot on the Gamecube controller. That way Nintendo wouldn't need to sell extra link cables for games like Four Swords Adventures and could utilize the GBA as jewish way of adding features to the GCN controller like gyro aim through dedicated cartridges. Given how the GBA completely monopolized the handheld space during the 6th gen this was something Nintendo could've pulled off to possibly great effect provided they didn't fuck up the technical aspects and the feature was widely supported by GBA+GCN third party devs. Christ the Gamecube was too pure for this world.
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>>2618 >GBA to fit into a dedicated slot on the Gamecube controller That's actually a pretty cool idea. Although weight would likely be an issue, to hold basically two gamepad's worth of heft. Without cables this is something that is feasible only now with tech weighting significantly less in general. My old LCD TV from 00s weighted a ton while the new one I got I can lift with one hand. >Christ the Gamecube was too pure for this world. It really was. Shockingly powerful considering the tiny dimensions of both the console and its discs. I feel that not many people realized back then and proly even now that it was much more powerful than PS2, but the compact size, color scheme and general appearance made it look more toy-like in comparison to the sexy sombre shapes of the PS2.
>>2621 The mini discs certainly didn't help the Gamecube, 1.46 GB vs a full 4.7 GB (or even 8.5 GB double layer) DVD on PS2 and Xbox. If a developer wanted to port their game to Gamecube they either had to split it across multiple discs (multiplying the manufacturing cost) or compress their assets to fuck.
>>2622 Honestly multiple discs isn't a problem and in fact a stipulation to make bigger games instead of trying to cram them onto a single DVD no matter what.
>>2623 The vast majority of PS2 and Xbox games are single disc though, indeed many don't even use all the space (though still well over the size of a GC disc).
>>2624 I meant the GC situation. It having to use multiple discs could be a benefit since even though a single disc fits less than a DVD, by stacking up several discs you could go over the DVD limit. PS1 used this to great success but I guess in the 6th gen it felt like a regress from having to use the hot new DVD technology and just 1 single disc for all your needs.
>>2621 I'm still mad at Kiketendo for being cheap shits with their magic money printer DS+Wii combo during the 7th gen and not making a Four Swords Adventures sequel using DS download play with all the shekels they got from selling Wii sports bundles to retirement homes.
>>2628 Why try anything when Wii is printing money.
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I use the Neo Pad 2 for all fighting games and 2D emulation. The circle pad has four microswitches. Best handheld fighting controller I've ever used. Expensive, I'd suggest using an ebay sniper or something like that, that or just waiting and being vigilant. I was going to replace the stick in an arcade stick someone gave me before I got this in, and haven't really thought about it since. I will replace that stick, got a dead zone in the left part of down left, just not in a hurry. Visually I really like the Master system Light Phaser, which is also the best lightgun there is with the absolute best games. As far as 2 button controllers it has my favorite looking and feeling one too. For 3D games I don't really care. The Duke for Xbox felt great in my hands, but only has one stick. The Dreamcast controller was nice but the dpad is GARBAGE TRASH FILTHY SHIT which means you have to remap some games that remapping could work on like Space Channel 5. The Wii U pad was very good for Splatoon and only Splatoon. The switch controller has good gyro for Splatoon but is not remarkable otherwise I prefer a PS2/3 controller instead. I enjoyed the two stage triggers on the Gamecube controller for Smash and probably something else. I can't think of a game that I play that would benefit from analog triggers, so I don't have an opinion on that. I've used a new Xbox controller once or twice. Like the PS2/3 controllers they're solid controllers, but that's that. I prefer the PS2/3 over new Xbox but it's just preference. The PS4 controller is gay with a gay touch thing for fagging around like a fruity little fag which queerly widens it out so I'd never have one myself. >pressure buttons, vibration That's fine, if the game calls for it and uses it well then it's welcome. >storage Wrap em with no tension on the part connected to the controller.
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>>2638 >I use the Neo Pad 2 for all fighting games and 2D emulation. Looks cool but to me using one gamepad for everything is kinda boring, even if it is super comfortable, it's nice to try different controllers. I also crave that authentic experience with the original controller the game was designed for. >Visually I really like the Master system Light Phaser It is a really cool looking gun, way better than the zapper. Although like with everything Sega, the Saturn version was the superior one.
>>2641 >boring Buddy you don't understand, it has microswitches. It's like a handheld arcade stick. I've got plenty of different pads, this one is simply the best mechanically. Better than every other option. Anyway, most of the 2D games I play I don't emulate so I'm using the native controller for that console for those
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Isn't there any good alternative gamepad type?
>>2670 i wonder if the banana actually felt gud despite all the memes...
>>2677 Is it even commercially available?
>>2677 Probably not in your hands.
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>>2677 I've read conflicting accounts on whether it's any good or not.
>>2398 >Is this true? Some players swear by it, that one Goldeneye youtuber used some controllers extensively and always comments a brand new/serviced N64 stick is much more precise than modern controllers, the problem is their knack for getting fucked after little use.
>>2776 >Some players swear by it Nintendrones no doubt.
>>2398 >>2511 >>2776 Are you seriously supposed to switch hand to the middle benis to use the analog stick?
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>>2836 There's people, me included, who literally never used the left-side handle to move the D-Pad because we didn't have games for it. I used it 15 years later when i collected stuff and got my hands on Mischief Makers, only to return it 2 days later and never finding another copy again for less than 15 bucks I recall a childhood friend who didn't use the right-side handle either, he used only the middle one and rested the right side into his right thigh and his also resting hand pushed the buttons from the side. I sometimes did the same which proved very comfortable after a while.
>>2837 >There's people, me included, who literally never used the left-side handle to move the D-Pad because we didn't have games for it. Wait, there were no games for the d-pad? Wasn't it usually the other way around and far fewer games used the analog stick back then?
>>2841 >there were no games for the d-pad? I mean you could use it instead of the analog for some stuff but games that absolutely needed or were played best with the D-Pad... yeah they were rare, on top of my mind i remember Mischief Makers, Kirby 64 and maybe Paper Mario but all three were scarce in the market and rare to see, Paper Mareeoh for example was not well promoted but was mouth-to-mouth famous and not long ago still able to be collected for cheap but everything changes due to Nintenfags with money to burn. Mischief and Kirby were pretty rare to see, i never saw them until 10 years later in the used market, kinda like Kirby Dreamland 3 for the SNES, i've never seen it in the open and this comes from somebody who saw Hagane and Devil's Crest, even Earthbound i've seen it multiple times but never Dreamland 3; Nintendo was odd and behaved erratically with some products.
>>2842 So no games used the d-pad to control the character and the analog stick to control the camera or something else? Cause that would mean switching grips every time and would be a nightmare.
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BIG
>>2843 >no games used the d-pad to control the character and the analog stick to control the camera? I don't recall that combo, i remember Goldeneye having the option to use a stick to move the character and another to move the camera but for that you needed two controllers, this was fun sometimes and some cutscenes have silly effects because the shoot button of the second controller worked there. Otherwise in many games the character control and camera control were both the same stick, in the aforementioned Goldeneye game you moved the camera by pointing the weapon into the corners of the screen, very archaic and one of the things that never felt quite right about the game but usually you got used to it. There was a lean sideways control setup too, never used that one but i've seen it works pretty good. >switching grips every time would be a nightmare. It was hence why nobody dared to find out if they could.
>>2977 Weird that they never figured that combo out. Although with that d-pad/analog stick placement it would be unplayable which shows they never even considered this possibility. I don't think any playstation game used both analog sticks for camera and movement control either despite the optimal placement.
>>2976 BLACK
>>2991 TRACKBALL
>>2977 >Otherwise in many games the character control and camera control were both the same stick what?
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