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Tú no puedes aprender el español Student 07/16/2020 (Thu) 05:30:14 ID: 3dc1e8 No.266
This thread is dedicated to learning the Spanish Language >Resources A lot of these are placeholders until we get some better suited purpose; please suggest any other resources you use or know about. >Flash cards https://apps.ankiweb.net/ - if you don't already have it, download anki for your flashcards. You can search through user generated, premade decks here https://ankiweb.net/shared/decks/spanish, but you can also create your own as you go along a different program >Dictionaries https://www.spanishdict.com/ - a multi-use tool for Spanish. Includes a fairly sized dictionary with pronunciation, a conjugation tool for verbs, and grammar lessons with quizes. It also has forums hidden away at https://www.spanishdict.com/answers https://www.wordreference.com/es/translation.asp - another dictionary that is slightly more expansive. It also has a conjugation tool and forums as well. It has more pronunciation and conjugation information for dialects outside of Castilian and than Spanishdict. https://www.wiktionary.org/ - an open source multilingual dictionary. In theory this is a resource for any language, but it is particularly good for learning Spanish. It has a lot of Spanish words, including obscure ones, and offers more information on dialectical differences in vocabulary than anywhere else. It also has a conjugation tool for verbs, and organizes them into conjugation classes well. >Learning resources https://studyspanish.com/ - Has a payed program, but offers almost everything besides some practice exercises for free on the website. It has a series of pronunciation lessons, grammar lessons, and vocabulary sets. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_phonology & https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_orthography pages containing detailed but technical descriptions of spanish pronunciation and writing. Not targeted to learners in the slightest, but very informative if you can undestand them. >What we need <More additional comprehensive learning resources, such as textbooks <Reading and listening material <any resources you think would be helpful >What to do here Please leave suggestions for more resources, or drop resources if you have access to them. Ask questions about Spanish or about how to learn it. Post about your experiences learning Spanish and about the life experiences that you gained because you learned it. Post about what you're reading or watching. Try simply chatting in Spanish, but be open to having others correct you, and try helping others correct their mistakes when they post.
What kind of Spanish does everyone learn? >Seseo or distinción (or ceceo) >Yeísmo or lleísmo >With Vosotros or without >Tuteo or voseo I personally Teach myself distinción, tuteo, and vosotros, but leave still do yeísmo. I also know Argentinian voseo forms a little bit, but not enough to use them comfortably.
South American Spanish except maybe Argentine is shit, best to learn European Spanish since all the best media and translations are in it, and the intellectual output of Spain alone is greater than all of Latin America combined.
>>275 It's also pragmatically easier to learn imo. z-c alteration makes a lot more sense with distinción, lleísmo removes some homophones and makes encoding speech easier, and having vosotros in addition to ustedes makes it easier to parse pronoun references in some cases. Argentinean Spanish is pretty cool though.
>>267 >First map is divided in countries but out of nowhere also states Batshit insane division there, it should be by regions, not so much countries. >South American Spanish except maybe Argentine is shit I would include all Latin American spanish is crap, including Argentina, but probably excluding Colombian due to their neutrality in pronunciations. >best to learn European Spanish since all the best media and translations are in it Highly ignorant comment although Spaniard Spanish is the most complete way to learn it, they don't kid around with their royal mandated language. >the intellectual output of Spain alone is greater than all of Latin America combined. Also a retarded claim, Barcelona is by far the biggest publisher house hub of spanish texts and media but they do it for the entire latin american continent, outsourced because of their proven quality and distributional experience. Hell spanish is not even their cultural language either, they know it for sure but they rather talk their own stuff.
>>278 >Spanish isn't even [Barcelona's] cultural language This. Barcelona is the capital of Catalonia, so of course the speak Catalan. Of course they all also know Spanish because it's the only official and national language of Spain, but Catalan is an official language in Catalonia.
Ah, I'm so ever glad you made this thread! I have some resources I mooched off of some russian website, I'll upload them and share them ASAP!
>>283 >The high school textbook cartel caught him uploading their overpriced shit and took this anon out Descansa en paz, Estudiante.
>>286 Nah I'm just having trouble juggling responsibilities.
>>278 I was talking about learning Spanish, not Catalan. And specifically comparing European Spanish with Latin American Spanish. But yeah if you want to watch movies, documentaries, read technical books, play videogames in Spanish, etc., the overwhelming majority of both good original content and translations will be available in European Spanish (complete with vosotros, tío, and guay).
Who here uses and/or knows about the rounded velar fricative? The idea is that Latin FU+vowel developed into a consonantal 'w' sound written 'hu+vowel', the same way that Latin 'FI+vowel' developed into 'hi+vowel' (pronounced like 'y'), and it also appears in loan words from English that use 'w'. Since it acts like 'y', it explains why some speakers pronounce words like "hueso" as 'güeso' or 'bueso', and "whiskey" as 'güisqui'. It's usually phonologically written as /w̝/ (w with an uptack, indicating more turbulence than an approximate), but you could also write it as /gʷ/ (or /bʷ/). Not every dialect has it, so it either only happened of some dialects of Old Spanish, or was lost in some dialects after it formed, but I know it's found in both Spain and the Americas.
>>291 >"whiskey" as 'güisqui' is actually incorrect/odd Well i'll be... Reminds me how iron ('Hierro') is pronounced as 'Fierro' or 'Yerro' in certain places.
>>292 >Hierro is pronounced as Yerro Yes, exactly. That one's actually very common, but rarely taught to English speakers. Look at any Spanish word that starts with "hi"+vowel on Wiktionary; the 'y' pronunciation is usually the first and often the only pronunciation listed. >fierro That must be really dialectical because that's basically Old Spanish. I know that some dialects of Asturian pronounce it that way though.
>>293 >That must be really dialectical From my experience it's very commonly used that way by rural/isolated cultures. I've heard it by deep-south argentinians, some mountain-top peruvians (or at least a couple of them on YT) and northern mexicans. >"hi"+vowel: Usually 'y' I recall in some english lessons how brit teachers mentioned very explicitly how "You" isn't 'Yu/Llu' but 'Hiuu', but because of that h we simply felt over again with 'Llu' when trying to talk in normal speed. 'Iu' is probably a more simpler way to say it but it might sound harsh on the ear. Now, dp say, how should "whiskey" be pronounced?
>>294 >How should "whiskey" be pronounced Depending on the dialect, 'uisqui' or 'güisqui'. RAE recognizes 'uisqui' as standard with 'güisqui' as an acceptable dialectical alternative. Some speakers who say "bueso" probably also say "buisqui", but it's not recognized by RAE as far as I know.
I can't understand any Spanish without subtitles . How do you train yourself to learn to understand what you hear?
>>303 How much do you practice listening without subtitles? If you use subtitles you'll just learn to read faster. Find something you can listen to that's about on your level of understanding, preferably something with visual cues as well like a TV show, and make yourself listen to it. Don't use subtitles at all while doing this. Actively listen and try to parse what they're saying; don't let yourself zone out and start listening passively.
>>304 >How much do you practice listening without subtitles? None, I have good understanding of reading Spanish but whenever I listen just am lost no matter how hard I try to listen.
>>305 The four language skills are reading, writing, listening, and speaking, and you would be amazed how little they feed into eachother, that is, how good someone can get at one of them while being terrible at another. You have to incorporate listening practice specifically into your studying if you want to make serious progress with your listening comprehension in a reasonable timeframe.
Are there names for the stems in Spanish like there are in Latin? For example, the normal names in Latin are the Present Stem, Perfect Stem, and Supine Stem. I figure that there very well might not be, because the stems are only distinct when the verb is in some way irregular, and they definitely aren't commonly used in teaching, but I wondered if there were technical terms used for them in academia or something.
Besides the fact that in section 2, it doesn't differentiate between adjectives and determiners, this is a really good source for explaining the placement of adjectives (i.e. before/after the noun): https://community.dur.ac.uk/m.p.thompson/adjectives.htm
Why would anyone want to learn filthy beaner goblinspeak? Disgusting ugly language spoken disgusting subhuman filth. pinche puta la madre y muerete goblinos
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>>385 >Mexico is the only Spanish speaking country Congratulations, Anon, you're as stupid as the average Tumblr SJW, just with the opposite politics.
I want to add to my adjective cards in my Anki deck to show when an adjective has different meanings before vs after a noun and when it has different meanings with ser vs. estar. Does anyone here have this in their decks? What would be a good format for including that information?
Can Spanish speakers hear the difference between the voiced allophones of /f/, /θ/, and /x/ ([v], [ð], [ɣ]) that appear before a voiced consonant, and the approximate allophones of /b/, /d/, and /g/ ([ꞵ˕], [ð̞], [ɣ˕])?
>>266 >Dictionaries you forgot the one to rule them all: the Real Academia Española one. the (RAE) is like the central institution that everybody looks up to when it's about language, either in Spain or in the Americas. It has the most complete dictionary out there, with thorough definitions of the words actual and historical meanings. The go to dictionary when reading, and I would recommend every intermediate or advanced anon to use it. It also has the etymology and conjugation of words. And it has a phone app. https://dle.rae.es/diccionario >Reading and listening material >cine https://www.elcohetealaluna.com/archivo-de-peliculas/ https://www.pelispedia.de/ https://cuevana3.io/ >subtítulos https://subadictos.net/ https://www.subdivx.com/ >libros https://www.gratislibros.com.ar/ https://lectulandia.me/ https://planetalibro.net/ https://www.elejandria.com/ https://planetalibro.net/ https://ebiblioteca.org/ https://epublibre.org/ I haven't checked all of these links. >>267 I would encourage learners to go with >distinción >lleísmo >vosotros if you want spain, without if Latam >tuteo this will be the most "neutral" and universal approach, imo; but really don't think about it that much, whatever you choose will make do in every country. the difference that non native speakers establish between latam and european spanish is really a meme to me. it's like distinguishing between american and UK's english: it's the same shit. people in argentina may not use "tú" but they know how to conjugate it and they could speak tuteando if they wanted to. the same with every other grammatical/phonetical differences in every other country. so the only thing that changes is every-day use. if you go to spain and you address someone as "vos" they may find it weird, but that's all. the real difference between countries is the jargon/slang, but you don't really learn that in books, i think. i do get why you make a distinction though, as it may be difficult when starting to learn both the tuteo and voseo forms, so you stick to just one. >>425 sorry m8 i can't be bothered with IPA. I can help if you give me some examples
>>427 The 'f' in "Afganistán" vs the 'b' in "subgrupo" The 'z' in "jazmín" vs the 'd' in "admisión" The 'j' in "ajamalina" vs the 'g' in "fragmentario"
>>428 ajmalina*
>>428 >>429 yeah I can definitely hear the difference in all of them. must be something u get with listening practice
>>425 >>428 bit late but I'll reply. I do hear the difference, especially in the first case. However, it's not that weird to hear the d in "admisión" pronounced as a z, same thing goes for the g in "fragmentario", you'll hear it often pronounced as j.
>>266 How does someone pronounce the "ll" correctly? Is it like Ly?
>>622 It's like a Gee in american english or Yi in chinaman. You meant "Ll" right? Word "Llano" would be something like Yah-Noh but without the very small "i" vocalization at the beginning that the Y makes. Also it's a matter of accent too, Cono Sur inhabitants spell it almost whispering which renders a sound similar to "Sh" (as in "shush!" or "shadow") while others, depending on the region, jump its pronunciation and you end up hearing something similar to an i as in the american english "Ee". So rather than Llano/Yah-Noh sometimes it will sound like Ee-Ah-Noh with some cold tongue folks while Conosur people spell it like Shah-Noh. I much rather have those silly distortions than having the ambiguity of vocals in the entire english language that, depending on the accent, can distort it into a Llena which is more confusing for the spanish-speakers thus the eternal confusion with anglo tourists.
I just come to appreciate how the most intrincate/specific of conjugations can be readily identified by native speakers, and be a total bitch for learners. Example: >consideraríamos, que consideraras. It's especially fun when doing that with long outlandish or simply made-up verbs. Here's an example of a popular sort of tongue-twister template, specific rendition from a popular yt channel (El robot de Platón) where the phrase 'pan con jamon' (bread and ham) is turned into a (obviously nonsensical) verb: >X ha sido panconjamonizado, quién lo despanconjamonizará? El que lo despanconjamonice, buen despanconjamonizador será. Have fun.
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As a native spanish speaker i barely know most of this shit, but i remember learning it when i was in primary school. So you guys need to memorize this, like the multiplication tables. The most important is indicativo.

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