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GFS - Gardening, Food acquisition and Stock keeping thread Strelok 07/30/2021 (Fri) 17:19:58 No.17689
Greetings Streloks, as anounced in >>17677, this is the thread about gardening, acquiring food and keeping stocks for long(er) Term survival. the main topics for this thread are -growing food for long term survival. -harvesting wild food if gardening is not an option for whatever reason. -legal and illegal food acquisition in areas where gardening is hard or undoable or in the case of insufficient skills. -wild gardening/guerilla gardening as alternative ways of growing food without owning land. >What is the purpose of the info ITT? This thread is aimed at providing information to every Strelok, on how to provide his own food, wether it is only for himself, or for a large fighting force. This is not only important for Post-collapse scenarios, but also an important factor of gaining freedom by independence from the government and society. >what does this have to do with /k/? At the time of the thread creation, /k/ is the board for weapons, combat and outdoorsmanship. A part of every armed conflict is the provisioning of food for the combatants to upkeep morale and fighting ability. Knowing how to grow and how to acquire food in any conditions is an important part of sustaining a fighting force, as the past has shown that a hungry soldier cannot win a conflict, and looting, even if an option, is only a short term solution, that cannot fully replace a stable supply of fresh provisions. Therefore, i see this as a quite important, and unfortunately overlooked aspect of /k/. >What goes in regards to posting. I'm not playing janny, but i'd prefer to keep this thread focused on the 4 main topics at the beginning of the Post. Related questions and discussion are welcome, and as long as it stays roughly on topic, i see the threads purpose as fulfilled. >Is there an end goal? A possible end goal would be a summarised sheet of information, that could (after extensive QC) be added to the boo/k/ "a world turned upside down", and a separate, condensed copy collected in an lightweight pamphlet to help aspiring streloks and newfags in obtaining basic information about starting to gain independence. >How often will Information be gathered into summary sheets? no idea, depends on how much traction the thread gets. An estimate would be one sheet every 100 posts, but as i said, that depends on the amount of content, and on it's quality.
as for the first question: >>17682 >Do Hügelkulturen work on sandy soil? Not in their usual form, no. What has to be done, is providing some form of erosion protection, in order to keep the wood at the base of the Hügelkultur covered to facilitate rotting. For this purpose, gaps and pockets of air between the wood can be filled with wood chips or grass clippings, and a few layers of news paper or grass clippings can be put at the base of the Hügel to prevent drainage and erosion. Otherwise, Hügelkultur works with practically any soil, as long as it's properties are taken into consideration.
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I think the 4x4x4 potato box/chicken wire cylinder is a must-have if your climate allows for potato growth. If it doesn't look for whatever tuber happens to grow there. Most tubers are edible so long as they aren't poisonous, some just require more chewing than others.
I have an experiment going on with more mobile chicken coops and greenhouses/grow tents. Shelter Systems makes a decent product, even if the chinks can't label the parts to save their bugmen lives. If these turn out well for growing food and medicinal plants, I'll let you guys know. One thing's for sure is that I want to grow a fuck ton of spicy peppers, partly because I like spicy stuff, but they also make great companion plants for gardens and other grows since they help discourage deer, bears, bugs and other pests. Mint is also good for this, especially since my neck of the woods has catnip growing all over the place, though peppermint is the one most recommended for keeping rodents away. When it comes to transplanting or just generally higher yields, a friend recommended to me a mix of Mammoth P beneficial microbes, a calcium and magnesium supplament, and unsulphered molasses l. Ive had good luck with the following recipe: 5 gallons of water 1ml Mammoth P 10tbsp molasses 25ml CalMag the PH should be around 6.0 to 6.3, but that's just in my area so ymmv.
Wasn't there a cooking thread or am I just imagining things? Anyways sounds like a good topic to start so I'll begin it with a general nutritional question about fat content in food. I have no scientific basis to go off of to know when you are consuming too much fat, all I try to do is listen to how my body feels afterwards to determine if i'm fulfilling my nutritional needs. Also when looking at different food groups is there one group that provides a better quality of fat than the others?
>>17690 >name of the pic Mind if I ask you whether or not you're Hungarian? Just because I can't really see this type of land cultivation here in glorious magyarland.
>>17704 The main problem with those tater-boxes, is that they require you to fill them with high quality soil, or mulch, which you'd have to get from somewhere. And if you already have a patch of soil that good, why not plant the taters there instead? Sure, you could use your compost as well, but then again, you could spread the compost on the tater patch too. So unless you really need to grow as many potatoes in as tiny an area as possible, don't waste your prescious soil on this box. And if you are in a situation where maximizing the output from an area that small matters, you probably don't have a garden large enough for you to be removing parts of your soil from it. You'd be better off buying soil. To be clear, I am not dissing them as an option. If you want to /neeed to grow taters on a small area, they are a perfectly fine option. But please don't waste your own precious soil/mulch on them.
>>19175 Boxes like that might be a reasonable choice for burdock or yam growing since both of those crops have much larger and deep roots than potatoes and are a lot more intensive to dig.
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>>17689 One of the most important things today to own when it comes to food is an energy efficient freezer. One cannot understand it's importance, it's even more important than to own a fridge. If anyone of you Streloks are still young, when you get your own place, buy the biggest and best freezer you can find. Ignore those shitty fridge/freezer combos. Why? The reason for that is that a freezer allows you to save a butt load of money in the long run, save you time and it allows you to preserve fresh food for several weeks as long as you have electricity. How does it do that? Well thanks to having a big ass freezer you can buy meat and vegetables when they are cheap or marketed down and simply chuck them into your freezer and they will be preserved until you need them. You can also precook whole meals, put them in bags and then unfreeze them when you need them. A fridge/freezer combo is too small to do that seriously and a fridge alone isn't cold enough. This is even more important when you live in the city and don't have a place to grow your own food. Think about how all this Corona bullshit started, at first it was only a few week of lockdown. People with a good stocked freezer didn't need to go out and if they owned a food supply of canned and preserved food on top they could hold out for a month and longer without a drop in live quality. Having a freezer is also important if you have read this thread and want to do any indoor gardening, because you lack the land or a suitable environment to grow stuff outside. Indoor gardening requires a certain amount of space to be reasonable and your harvesting routine is different than outdoors. To control the humidity and avoid mold you have to at least think about something on the size of a midsize terrarium and be able to preserve large quantities of your harvest on at quick notice. A freezer will you help with that. Avoid plants that require pollination and you should invest into a plant light, as your plants grow weak if they don't get the right kind of light, just the light through the window is to little for most crops.
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Does /k/ have any advice on growing wheat? More specifically the winter wheat variety used for making bread. I live in the dark red area of the cotton belt for reference.
>>19175 For me the advantage is that I don't have a yard but I have physical concrete space I can plant basic crops in. It's similar to how I have space to grow tomatoes, but no dirt of my own to do it in. My city is far enough out West that I could actually flee if I needed to, but I can set one of these up on my front porch with a privacy lattice that I plan to grow poison ivy on to keep out squirrels, animals, children, and vegetable thieves for less-than-ideal but not apocalyptic scenarios.
>>19177 Can't recommend this enough. I make meals for 12-20 people at a time, store 90% in the foot freezer in individualized freezeable/microwaveable containers, and pull out a few at a time for lunches throughout the month. It's an economic solution and the top-down approach while harder to rummage through ensures that your shit stays frozen for days at a time during power outages so long as you maintain ~50% or higher capacity.
>>19182 >Winter wheat You could grow it with "dry irrigation" (so not flooding the field like retards). Be careful of what you plant as certain windbreaks/plants will attract bugs. Also be careful of elevation since most diseases you can deal with are fungi and do not travel up elevations easily. Check your soil so you don't have root rot (Gaeumannomyces tritici and Cephalosporium gramineum). Don't eat ergoted wheat unless you want to get high and die from chronic ergot exposure. I would ask you specifically what part of the dark red area you are in (since even then there is much variation) but that's a pretty glow move and I don't like getting ran over
>>19179 Just, like, throw it on the ground and let it grow. Winter wheat, as the name indicates, is usually sown in fall, and gets harvested in spring. Wheat needs to be dry when it's harvested or it rots very quickly. A week of no rain is best, but three days or so tend to be acceptable (also depends on the strength of the sun). Don't harvest before it's properly ripened either. I'd say the golden color is an indicator, but there's shades of it so unless you've got experience that's no real help. There's testers for moisture levels, but I'm not sure how much they cost. Generally, you want more rain when it just starts to look like wheat, and little to no rain when it starts drying out and going golden. Bushel up, hang from rafters and let it dry a bit further, then thresh it. I think the nips have combs to thresh smaller quantities of rice, might be worth a look to see if they'd work for wheat too. Don't forget to store it in rat-proof containers, or suspended off the ground.
>>19182 >poison ivy as deterrant To those who aren't knowledgable enough to decern garden weeds from poison ivy by the time they get the rash they'll have had made baked potatoes. As an immediate deterrant maybe you could try wrapping thorns around the box instead of risking getting urushiol oil from the ivy on your clothes when you go to manage your garden, thats how people get the rash dispite thinking they handled it properly plus the shit can become an overgrown mess getting mixed with your potato leaves. Maybe even try kale, most burgerstans would run at the site of it.
>>19189 Just plant raspberries. They produce edible fruit and are 100% effective at blocking anything larger than a rat from crossing through. https://ytb.trom.tf/watch?v=RuzLXxbGc4c
>>19182 Another thing I hadn't thought about in favor of poison ivy is to instead set out warning signs with bullet points to really sell the toxicity of the plant to a would be theif with a WARNING or a DOT toxic placard with skull and cross bones. WARNING >Poison Ivy secretes toxic colorless odorless oil >Can cause severe full body rash lasting weeks >Rash CANNOT be cured >Oils persist for weeks on clothing >Burning the plant can be lethal if inhaled This really makes me want to start investing in pest repelling plants and other highly toxic exotic crops that thr consequences are little known by normalcattle.
>>19182 >I plan to grow poison ivy on to keep out squirrels, animals Don't bother for that reason. Most animals are completely immune to poison ivy. Because it's not actually a toxin, it's an allergen that primarily only affects humans. It doesn't even affect humans uniformly. My grandma was immune. I think a lot of asians may be immune as well since they used a closely related plant to make lacquer from. If you want to keep things out just grow osage orange as a hedge and braid the branches. Or grow patches of stinging nettle, which is actually also both a useful cooked vegetable and source of fiber for textiles.
>>19203 I'm the Strelok who suggested stinging nettle back in the day originally. It works ok but it only really keeps out dogs, skunks, and raccoons.
>>17689 >harvesting wild food if gardening is not an option for whatever reason Don't collect plants from roads that are used by cars. The fumes pollute the ground and are taken in by the plants that grow alongside it. The same goes for roads and places that are heavily used by people to walk their dogs or have pick nicks. They will leave around plastic which also leeches into the soil. You also don't want to collect plants in regions that have factories who blow their shit all over the country side. You can ignore this advise in an emergency, but for regular usage be aware that a plant is only as healthy as it's surrounding. In my hometown there are a lot of ancient fruit trees I don't collect from for this very reason. They were planted in a time before cars and heavy industry. With lead us to this: -wild gardening/guerilla gardening as alternative ways of growing food without owning land. Guerilla gardening in the city is a leftist meme for publicity. They throw some dirt on the sidewalk, plant some flowers that will be dead in a week, make some picture and then never give a fuck about what they planted. Real gardening takes some work and dedication. In the city most grounds are polluted by decades of industrial usage. If you really want to plant crops in a city you need a raised bed and fill it with soil, which is a lot of work for anything serious. And then you have to deal with the problem that your plants need time to grow, at least half a year before they produce fruit. If in this time your garden is discovered and destroyed you start at zero. And that just covers the human side of things. Animals can easily destroy all your work if you don't take some time daily and make sure they don't eat your plants.
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>>19207 Well that's why I added osage orange. Nothing fucks with osage orange. The only thing in the US withe meaner thorns than osage is honey locust but honey locust really isn't amenable to be turned into a hedge. Honey locust thorns are useful for being turned into nails and the fruit is a good survival food though.
>>19212 The pollution combustion engines cause to surrounding plants is really overstated since most countries swapped to unleaded gasoline. Plants near roads are bad because runoff brings all the piss, shit, chemicals, and trash across it via water. Not because of a little smog (a little smog just keeps it from photosynthesizing as well resulting in smaller produce overall, not "bad for you" produce. Same with radiation for the most part).
>>19226 One alternative could be closely planted blackthorn(Prunus spinosa) it has a long history of being used as a living fence to ward property in Europe. It's thorny as fuck, the berries can be turned into jam and liqueur(have to be frozen once or they are sour) and their wood is used to make canes and clubs.
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>>17689 >what does this have to do with /k/? Gardening and warfare have a long history together, before the invention of barbed wire militaries all over the world relied heavily on trees and bushed to build fortifications. Farmers had the duty to plant trees and hedges alongside roads and boarders and together with simple trenches they created near impenetrable walls of greenery. Often the trees would also be cut to block the road for the enemy and bushed would be cut and bound to the ground to stop infantry from advancing against the own lines. There are many names for this, the most common is Abatis in English, but they are also known as Landwehr, Verhau or Gebück in German and Zaseka in slavic languages. They have been used by the ancient Romans and they were still used as late as World War 2. Europe is covered in small towers that seem pointless on their own, but in the past they guarded the entrances to these gigantic war hedges that covered Europe like a jigsaw puzzle. These wooden fortifications of Europe are truly one of the most overlooked aspect of European history as they proof how sophisticated our ancestors were compared to other cultures even with just basic things at their disposal. Anyone interested in guerilla warfare or in building a protected homestead in case SHTF is will advised to learn about these techniques. Btw. while searching for pictures for this post I found a great article about Russians growing tropical plants in arctic regions: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2020/04/fruit-trenches-cultivating-subtropical-plants-in-freezing-temperatures.html
alright, OP here, i've been away for quite some time now, but i finally found an opportunity to get back to this thread. >>19173 I am not, although i would really like to learn the language. It is so rare, that it could basically work like a secret language. As to the file name, the pic is stolen, because my artistic ability is as good as the Gun laws in the UK. >>19172 I am not a food expert, but i try to keep to a balanced diet. For fat, i recommend just eating meat and fish. If you like milk (i do), you can supplement your fat intake with it. Also, nuts provide fat in moderation. >>19177 believe it or not, i own a fridge-freezer combo, a an upright freezer, and i recently got an old chest freezer from a relative, So i can basically hoard supplies. Still, for long term food storage, i strongly recommend canned food, and please, consider getting into canning, it helps save money, and it is extremely efficient for saving veggies, fruit and meat for a very long time. >>19228 can confirm this one, since i live in a rural area with a bunch of roads and raspberries and rosehips, and i often ate them as a child. I'm still healthy and in good shape. Although, it should preferably not grow near fields, because that's where a lot of chemical contaminants like artificial fertilizers and pesticides and insecticides come from. >>19230 blackthorn grows in big clusters around my place (old farmstead). The advice with freezing them is absolutely needed, everyone who ever tried to eat those off the bush will agree. >5th pic Otto Ficker GmbH maximum kek >>19232 There are still a lot of these types of defences around, if you know what to look for. It's quite unassuming, but once you try to get through a thicket, you notice all the subtle hurdles that prevent a quick passage. The modern german "Knick" is, despite being simply for providing protection for wildlife, closely resembling those old defensive constructions.
>>19372 >plebbit spacing kill yourself. Back on topic to the thread, I highly suggest using trees as an orchard crop if you don't mind yield being off at times (Hi Pecans). They may also be good for actual cover if jamal and co. come up to siege you. Or if you need firewood desperately. Depending on where you are in the USA, you can probably plant these. Hardiness is noted after species name. These are just my recommened ones, I prefer native plants if possible unless foreign disease is raping them: Chestnut (Castanea spp.) 3-8 Note: Depends on species heavily. Avoid native american ones because dumb idiot Sinophiles in the early 20th imported blight from China/Japan American Chestnut (C. denata, C. pumila, C. ozarkensis) 2-8 Assuming SUNY released the line with blight immunity, otherwise avoid Note: C. ozarkensis classification as seperate species debatable. C. Pumila and C. ozarkensis hardiness 6(?)-8. Latter is also critical endanged and only exists in fragments in the Ozarks. Butternut (Juglans cinerea) 2-7 Note: Currently getting massacred by diease, but is useful if you live in like WY where its really cold. Get a hybrid with disease resistance or live outside natrual range. American Persimmon (Diospyros virginiana) 2-9 - Note: Not really edible until fully ripe, has other uses as dye, tanning. Long term graft incompatibility with D. Kaki (We're talking 30+ years here) Asian Persimmon (D. kaki) 4-9 Note: Non astrigent ones are usually 8+, must be grafted to D. virgininana rootstock to not die from root rots. Apricot (Prunus armeniaca) 4-9 Note: Higher zones may not set fruit due to chilling requirements Pecan (Caya Illinoiensis) 4-10 Note: Graft compatible with other Caya species. Use water hickory if your area is waterlogged. Be careful which cultivar you plant since not always pollen compatible Apples (Malus spp.) 3-10 Note: Depends on species.Mostly in the colder areas <8 "Walnuts" (Juglans spp. exc butternut) 4-9 Note: Depends on species, usually graft compatible. Texas Persimmon (D. texana) 7-10 Note: Lives in arid calceric soils, doesn't like humidity, more of a grape like fruit used for wine or something. Useful tannins for dye/leather work. Not graft compatible with other Diospyros genus in US. Peach/nectarines/plums (Prunus persica e al.) 5-9 Note: Not recommened in the US great plains since early freeze fucks everything over (So like TX/OK/AK/ND/SD ) New world "prunis species" (Prunus sect. Prunocerasus) 6+(?) Note: Includes desert crops. Highly varied so check with research. Lacking research due to lack of commercial production. Non tree, vine like fruit: Grapes Vitis spp. (4-10) Note: Most European grapes are 7-10, need to be grafted to american rootstocks (specifically: V. routundfolia) so they don't get raped by phylloxera. Native grapes are astringent and don't taste "as good". Avoid places where its hot and humid at night (Hi, Texas). As you can imagine for something that is a niche crop, many, MANY disease issues. Also needs lots of training and pruning (not worth imho). Kiwis (Actinidia spp.) 4-12) Note: In US outside of FL probably grow A. arguta since it is 4-8, others are tropical. Be prepared to suffer since they can grow up to 20 feet per YEAR. Tomatos/Cucumbers/others: Check with your local extention/ online, too many to list here FAQ: >How long until I get fruit 3-10 years (average 5), grafting mature stock may help induce earlier fruit production >How the fuck do I graft? Go read a book. I will warn tree grafting is very difficult versus say, tomatos/ cucurbites >Best time to take cuttings? When plant is dormant. Not always, research plant in question. >Strelok what if I live in a desert? Plant local cactus have fun or Texas Persimmon (D. texana), otherwise good luck supplying 40+ gallons of water a day for when the end of the world comes. >Strelok what about fruits like oranges? Unless some jackass finds a citrius greening immune species, that entire genus is fucked in 30 years. >Strelok what about caffine? Get yaupon holly (Ilex vomitoria) 7-9 it's technically a tree but everyone thinks its a shrub, shit is like tea but native to the southern US, higher caffine content than coffee or tea, and wont get rekt by disease (Coffee is fucked if they don't figure out a cure to coffee rust in a decade or so) >What about almonds? Almods are the reason California is running out of water, that shit is really water intensive and literally dies if you look at it weird. >I have a question you didn't answer here! Ask in the thread and I might answer.
>>19380 literally never used plebbit, and i have no idea what your problem is. but thanks for atleast providing useful info instead of just leaving a pile of steaming shit in the thread. You seem to have experience with orchard gardening. Did you ever work with cherry plums? how widespread are they in the US? I know they're quite widespread in Germany, and i use them a lot for making jams and preserves. They're quite tasty, too. Maybe if someone is interested, i can provide a little info about working with those.
>>19394 >chery plumbs I haven't seen any in the area I work in but I live in a cold as fuck area so.... USDA Zone 5-9 (there's a few zone 3 varities, no idea bout them). Not commonly seen in the great plains states or east coast due to the high likelyhood of early spring frosts causing blind nodes and fruit cracking issues (like with all prunus genus). Brown rot issue is an issue in the USA. Susceptible to disease due to lack of fuzz.
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>>19187 I apologize for the late reply; I've been busy with real life >Just, like, throw it on the ground and let it grow. Do you mean that in the most literal sense? Just throw it on the ground? I don't need to do any tilling? >>19186 Thanks anon. The area i have planned to plant the wheat at doesn't get flooded so I'm not worried about that. I am concerned about various pest like aphids and other annoyances but since this is the first year I'm not going to take it too hard on myself if shit goes sideways. Also, as for my location, I'm unwilling to reveal where I am but I was able to find some advice about planting wheat where I live. >>19380 Do you have any advice on processing water oak acorns? Does the process differ from other acorns? Also, what is your opinion on the water oak? I've heard some people claim it's basically a large weed but I don't really see where this is coming from. I know they can be messy but that only becomes a problem if you don't have wild life/ animals around to eat it.
>>19418 >throw it on the ground If you want to get really scientific, it depends on the seed cultivar. Most seeds have a specific planting depth otherwise will not germinate. Other have a hard requirement on the directionality of the seed. Wheats planted on large enough scale that it doesn't really matter. >water oak No idea on processing. For the tree? Takes ~20 years to set fruit, USDA zone 6 ish. Does not tolerate shade, extensive pruning,compaction (eg; you parking a truck on top of its roots), or drought at all. Somewhat resistant to sudden oak death (imho). Readly hybridizes with rest of oaks (its a fagaceae trait) and as thus expect for acorns to vary widely. If you are looking for this stuff in southern US, try grafting scab resistant pecan (Carya illinoinensis) onto water hickory rootstock (C. myristiciformis). You can, at least directly eat pecans.
>>19418 I am, more or less. To be accurate: Before throwing them on the ground, wet them for a couple hours, then add powdered clay on top and swirl in a circular motion, spraying with water and adding clay as necessary to form small clay balls of each seed. Then throw them on the ground, depending on type, either a bit after the harvest, covering them in the straw of the previous harvest, or in spring, about two weeks before weeds start coming up. If you're using previously untilled/unfarmed ground, start by using daikon and similar vegetables beforehand for two or three years to get the ground softer. Don't worry about weeds, they'll be less problems than you think if you stick to the instructions. Never remove more than you eat, all straw and such must return to the field to rot. Full method is in the books below. One thing that may require adjustment is watering: This was a method developed in a pretty humid part of Nippon, depending on how much it rains and how hot your summers get, you'll have to water.
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For anons considering Osage Orange gardening, right now is the end of the "harvest season" for the fruits, so you're going to see the seeds going for sale online in the next couple weeks if they aren't already. I'll be buying about 100 seeds and seeing if I can nurse some into growing over the winter (testing some in wet stratified soil as is recommended and some in plain dry soil that I won't wet until spring, the rest of the seeds staying in the fridge until spring) in my window so I can plant them outdoors next spring. Planning to give some to family members if they sprout good. A lot of gardening centers will be running clearance on their nursery pots as well soon I bet with going into Autumn.
Also the more I read up on these osage orange bushes, the more I get pissed off since the only reason they fell out of favor is because mass-farming machinery can't handle the bushes and barbed wire is faster. With bare minimum maintenance you have an effective insect-repellant bush that attracts earthworms/birds and scares off squirrels/rats/most mammals. They have a nice citrusy smell when not rotting, and they require virtually no maintenance past occasional watering during droughts after the first year and trimming after the second year. The wood is flexible and was used by Injuns to make bows, it burns like charcoal if your heat ever goes out, and all around it's just a great utility plant to have in your garden even if you're not using it for hedges. It prevents soil erosion and acts as an effective wind barrier too. Fuck, this plant is awesome so long as you put the bare minimum effort in to take care of it. I don't have the space for a hedge, but when I move in a few years I can just transplant the bushes from a two foot barrel pot into the ground. It sounds like they just grow like goldfish, so they'll be satisfied with whatever sized pot you decide to plant them in (and if you plant them outdoors with spacing they just grow like a tree). Hopefully these grow ok. I'm going to try to grow eight plants. 3 with proper watering indoors. 3 without proper watering indoors until spring. 2 that I'll just leave outside over the winter/not do anything to, and see what happens (1 in direct sunlight/exposure to the elements, 1 under a mesh chair). I want to see just how robust these guys are.
>>19621 If you want to take cuttings for propagation then the best times are late winter fro hard wood cuttings and june/july for soft wood cuttings.
Just ordered some Kale seeds to plant in the mean time while I wait for frost to end so I can germinate cucumbers, squash, eggplant, sweet peppers, cayene peppers and tabasco peppers for spring. I'm planning on starting the Kale seeds off in a raised grow box then resow in a pot after harvesting. I'll do the same to all the others when the time comes because the soil isn't soft enough. Long term i'ld like the ecosystem to consist of a balance of local flora supplimentary to the soil fertility. The real challenge will be staying organized so I wont get complacent and overlook something that might negatively impact growth. I've taken some steps like having a periodic table to physically reference WHAT PLANTS KRAVE [spoilee]C, N, and O.[/spoiler].Any tips on improving soil fertility without having to buy fertilizer?
>>19691 >Kale You may want to look into Everlasting Kale, especially the king thereof, the Taunton Deane. Came about in the Victorian times and was shared by cuttings from gardener to gardener. It has its main growth periods when there's little other vegetables, but it regrows fairly speedily all year round. One plant per person is a good idea, two to three if you tend towards a poor peasant's diet. Grows to a man's height, and has strong growth for 5-10 years, becoming sort of mini-tree like. Very hardy, but doesn't like drought at all. Needs to be kept under 0.7mm wide netting to protect from butterfly larvae, which will fucking murderize it by eating it all. Must be propagated by cuttings, as a century of being propagated left it virtually infertile. Try Ebay for cuttings. If the only ones you find are from britbongistan, consider messaging them to arrange an express-package (trust me, this thing's worth it, it's a miracle plant) and waiting for very early spring, when the plant is more vital than in fall, though fall cuttings may also serve. As for raising productivity: Never remove any cuttings from your garden. Straw, cutoffs, etc. must go back to where they came from, ideally composted. Biomass can be readily acquired by offering to mow other people's lawn. Just bring a cart to take all the grass, compost it, spread it. Chickens are good for fertility, and they tend to not damage plants after they've grown beyond a certain size. Just change the place you let them into now and then. If you butcher something, you can throw the blood in your compost bin. Human shit can be composted too, but must ripen for 3 years. Look up a design for a composting toilet if you're into this (ties into removing nothing from the garden, this gives what you ate back) Green manure helps. Consider adding a year for raising it to your rotation. Seed mixes for this are cheap. You can then either just cut it and let it rot over winter, or compost it.
>>17824 Will you eventually get beehives?
>>19623 >Osange It's a good latex (natrual rubber) plant too, I don't know of anyone vulcanizing rubber from it though. It probably would've gone extinct in the next thousands of years since its already evolved into a dead in. You could probably plant Parthenium argentatum in the US for a rubber plant though (assuimg you live in the desert/southern us) >>19691 >fertilizers Compost with some fermentation in a tank at 72F can do a lot. Just makes sure you don't have any disease in the material, and be sure you plant something that does well in the climate you are in (so don't go planting say, celery in a high salt area). Just remember the disease triangle. As a bonus, as long as your climate isn't too abnormal you shouldn't have disease issues. Just remember that you'll still get fucked by herbicide drift This shit is the no1 cause of agriculture lawsuits
>>19691 >>19693 I'm growing some sea kale right now. Hopefully the seedlings will get big enough to harden off before winter.
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/k/ do you have any advice on planting onions? I just bought some white onion bulbs to plant. I'm the cotton belt anon, btw. Also, I've been thinking about using some potatoes that have started to sprout. any advice on planting them? They are russets to be exact.
>>21038 No idea honestly. I planted a regular old supermarket onion, it actually grew and flowered, and I collected the seeds in late autumn. Gonna spread them out next spring. I planted the onion in a 50/50 mix of dirt from my backyard (slightly more on the clay side) and composts from my pile ( I put everything on it, grass clippings, kitchen scraps, fruit tree branches, chicken droppings and some mixed woods chips). It lived in my backyard, sunny, rainy and generally wet climate (northern Germany). Just rip out the weeds around it, it's generally pretty hardy, just like garlic.
I would recommend red onions instead of white ones. In my experience and the experience of relatives and friends white onions seem to mold the quickest. The red onions are the most healthy and sturdy ones from all the different types of onions I've harvested. I harvested white ones, yellow/golden ones and red/violet ones. The white ones are the sweetest, which might be the reason for their quick molding.
>>21041 Red variety tend to rot faster around here, but I live in a desert, so it probably has something to do with the dampness of the environment allowing mold to spread since normally the sugar would act as a preservative inside the onion.
>>21044 I live in the north, so that's a pretty different climate. This year has a lot of rain here.
>>21038 On top of what ever kind of bulb onions you decide to go for I'd suggest you also get some bunching onions. They're a good near constant source of fresh onion tops and bottoms and are reall easy to start from seed.
>>21038 As to actually answer you question, have you considered multiplier onions, sometimes called potato onions?
>>21105 Alright, I'll look for some bunching onions next time I'm out. The sound interesting, but what exactly are bunching onions? From my fairly brief research I discovered they were basically spring onions. Do you have any specific variety to recommend? The guardsman and deep purple variety seem interesting. I like the guardsman for being fast growing and as silly as this might sound, I have never seen a purple spring onion before. >>21112 No I actually haven't actually. Like I said in my previous post, I'm in the cotton belt, More specifically, Zone 8. Would those onions even work in this area? >>21039 That actually sounds like a fun idea. Spread out some kitchen scraps and see if it grows.
>>21140 Welsh Onion. Hardy Perennial onions. The least work possible for the most onion.
>>21140 >zone 8 Just be careful of thrips/aphids/whiteflies. In addition, day length is more important for onions that most climactic requirements. I believe the majority of the cotton belt states can only grow short/intermediate day onion . Make sure to save seeds and rotate so you don't get pink root (soil borne fungal disease), that shit is a bitch to remove without EPA banned chemicals (Methyl Bromide). As for dividing where to plant short/intermediate onions, intermediate for the northern portion, on USDA 7-8 border on the red river.
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>>21140 >they were basically spring onions They are but they're a special kind of spring onion that multiplies and "bunches" together and mkes a perennial patch. So don't harvest all at once. >Do you have any specific variety to recommend? Either Evergreen or White Spear. I prefer Evergreen because it's hardier but that's not so much an issue for you. There's also the Egyptian Walking Onion which is a hybrid mutant between the common onion and bunching onion. I actually produces small underground bulbs and tiny above ground bulbs in addition to green onions. I would suggest growing them along with bunching onions rather than instead of. >No I actually haven't actually. Like I said in my previous post, I'm in the cotton belt, More specifically, Zone 8. Would those onions even work in this area? According to the place that I've bought them from they should >The Yellow Potato onion has good drought resistance, pink root resistance, and is widely adapted for different growing regions, except Florida and southern Texas.
>>21140 Upgrade. Plant Hardiness Zone Map (2012, USDA.gov)
>>17689 What are some good mushrooms to try and grow to spice-up my meals? I've been thinking of growing some to grind and mix with either ground poultry or beef to make burgers go further, or to add it to stews And from what I've been reading, if you've got the right conditions and species, growing mushrooms is a breeze.
Currently have some random stuff planted on my back porch: >peas and bunching onions planted about a month ago and going well, although I may have planted them too close to each other >roma tomato and peppers today going to pick up some more pots and planters over the weekend and plant the rest of the stuff I have, when you buy seed bags they apparently expect you to have a dozen planters for each plant, instead of only one in my case. anything else I should keep in mind?
Also where would I get potatoes for cultivating? Could I just buy one from the produce section and let it grow, or should I get speshul ones bred specifically for growing?
>>32172 You can refrigerate seeds to keep them dormant for up to two years reliably 5 years unreliably, just make sure not to freeze them. Make sure you're getting the right soil for the right stuff, but it sounds like most of the things you're growing will be fine in regular potting soil. >>22281 Shiitake is fickle but has a distinct taste. Enoki, oyster mushrooms, and lion's mane are all fairly hardy so long as you properly sterilize everything. Fly amanita are tasty but have to be boiled in a large pot to remove the toxins or else you will get high and they grow basically everywhere. Most of the tastier mushrooms are also unfortunately wild-growing as well. >>32173 Potatoes are typically clone plants rather than seed plants since most of the time potato seeds just produce ivy. Any seedling potato (1-2 inch potato) will do as a starter. I've had mixed luck growing from grocery stores but if it's sprouted and doesn't have signs of rot or fungus you will be fine. Just remember potatoes need a lot of sun and a LOT of fertilizer since the tuber is basically the plant's energy storage for a dry/cold/cloudy day.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuYGS5pLRZg Farmer explains how he uses (mostly) gravity-fed terrace permaculture to keep his fields irrigated year-round, and how he uses a solar pump for water storage in case of drought. It should be noted it's a mountain farm in the cold rainforests of Oregon, so it's not as if this can be done everywhere.
I haven't posted much about my garden on /k/, but it's been doing really well recently. I planted tomatoes, green beans, and potatoes as my summer crop, and the first two have done really well so far. However, the potatoes were a disappointment, mostly because of the drought and heatwaves here. In addition, once the potatoes and greenbeans have been harvested, I uprooted them and planted black-eyed peas and cherokee wax green beans. Now I'm getting ready for the winter crops, which are lettuce, brussels sprouts, and spinach. Hopefully I'll get a good yield on those.
I currently grow a decent amount of cannabis - what are similar edible plants I could learn to grow? Tomatoes are an obvious answer, but what else?
>>39350 >similar In terms of their DEA class or their variety of uses after being processed? Poppy plants make some sense given their similar medicinal uses to treat pain. So long as you can keep any processing covert you've got a homegrown pharmacy going. I'ld also suggest something I was told in person by someone who has a family farm whose cannabis crops are enveloped inside a much larger crop of corn as a smoke screen to their real process. Just an idea though.
>>39350 Onions are pretty straightforward. I've gotten seed from onions that began growing a stalk when left on the counter for 2-3 weeks. Vegetables that go with eggs have good synergy since you can own egg-laying chicken breeds to prune the vegetable paths of bugs and get eggs from them most of the year. Learn to lime-treat eggs and you can have chicken eggs year round too. https://www.askaprepper.com/how-to-preserve-eggs-with-lime-water/
>>39350 >>39366 Cannabis is legal to produce in Romania for agricultural use (seed, oil, textiles, etc.). It can be grown with recreational intent so long as it is declared that the crop is for the interest of medical science or medical use. Just informing any glowniggers who happen to be watching this thread in advance of inevitable global reports. As for poppy, it's a fairly labor-intensive plant to process for culinary use and you need a very specific environment to grow it for any other use which I seriously doubt anon has.
Hi anons. I'm in the southwest and need to start composting again. However, the challenge out here is to little moisture. I had started a heap and it basically didn't compost like in wetter parts of the USA, not enough moisture, not enough breakdown. Desiccation was a problem. Overheating was an issue, the pile gets so hot it kills everything, even the good bacteria. I would use wood to make a compost box, but I am leaning towards a plastic trashcan, due to moisture keeping. I might however go with metal, but again the issue of overheating arises. Is there anyone experienced with this that can recommend anything else I need to consider? Appreciate any input.
>>39853 >Dessication Stir it regularly with a shovel (every 2-3 days) and add some water here or there. Use more green waste (food/leafy waste) and less brown waste (wood/stems). If you're growing desert crop varieties, adding some sand to the mix will help retain moisture. If you have a neighbor with a baby, ask them for spare diapers that no longer fit their kid; the polymers inside the piss sack are perfect for helping the compost bin or your garden retain moisture. >What kind of material? Resin. Plastic is fine for nonedible plant compost, but you should use a resin if working with edible plant compost. Metal can harm the microbes so avoid it.
I got about a dozen hot peppers from my plants yesterday and I don't know what to do with them. Suggestions?
>>39879 >Suggestions? Plant your peppers with a few weeks inbetween next year instead of all at once. >Immediate suggestions? Peppers pickle well and dry well so my suggestion would be to dry the ones you don't plan to use immediately. The pickling method is also the basis for making preserved sauce from your peppers. You can extract the juice/heat from the pepper with virgin coconut oil and it makes an excellent topical anesthetic/analgesic for bug bites and the like. Just avoid exposure to eyes/genitals if you do that.
>>39370 >Cannabis If you want to play it safe so much, then you should call it hemp.
>>39879 Do you do any canning? If so, you could throw them into a blender with some tomatoes and whatever else you like in chili or pasta sauce. Then can or freeze them for later use.
>>39887 Hemp is only one type of cannabis
>>39370 >poppies for culinary use >labour intensive How so? The pods ripen on the vertical at which point the stem dries out. You just walk through the field and snap off the ripe pods and put them in a fine weave bag or whatever then once you get them inside you just snip off the "cap" and upend the pod into your container. Purple poppies contain roughly a teaspoon of seeds each while the red ones contain a quarter of that. I'd even venture to say that per kilo of seeds, poppy seed harvesting could well be more labour-efficient than (pre-industrial) wheat harvesting.
>>32173 >>32178 One thing you need to be REALLY careful of with potatoes is viruses. Plant viruses are a bitch to deal with because they can't actually kill the virus the way mammals do so the only way to treat a plant virus is to burn the host and potatoes do not die. I once planted a store bought potato which I firmly believe had been intentionally inoculated to stop home growers and it produced so many diseased little tubers that it was years before I killed the last one. While the plant did produce solid yields despite its illness, it produced far less than it could have and all the tubers it did make were full of hard necrotic lumps. In conclusion, I highly advise you don't use store bought potatoes. Get the "planting" potatoes from the gardening store so you know that they are clean.
>>39908 There is a way to salvage a virus infected line of potatoes from viruses but it requires a micro propagation (i.e. tissue culture) setup to do it so it's not really worth it unless you are trying to rescue an important cultivar from viruses. Other things you could do to clear potatoes of viruses is to plant the potato seed, the actual seed from the berry. Of course that won't necessarily come true.
>>39879 What climate do you live in and what kind of peppers?
>>39876 thank you anon, really helpful. I forgot about those silica beads in diapers and I have some of the material lying around so that will help with moisture retention. I haven't fully decided my list of plants yet, but I know (((jerusalem))) artichokes will most likely be on the list, probably for a combo of memes and food. Most likely regular artichokes, carrots, luffa, beans, sweet potatoes do really well here, not sure what else yet.
>>39908 yes, store bought potatoes are designed to die and spread diseases so that you have to use monsanto products. Never, ever plant stuff you get from the store that isn't a seed unless you are being really experimental, especially if it is near other stuff.
>>39948 >>39908 I've only planted spuds that were already growing roots, and admittedly they never flowered/I had to kill the plant after squirrels half-killed it ripping off the propagation roots, but I never had any disease with them. The nonedible plants I panted in their containers afterwards have been doing fine for months now.
>>39957 It doesn't always happen, but my point is that it isn't worth the risk. Once you get a diseased specimen in your garden it's there for good and the aphids and ants are gonna spread it to your healthy potatoes and maybe even your other nightshades. Why deal with all that bullshit just so you can save a couple of dollars on a single purchase of slightly overpriced spuds?
>>39947 If you're in the market for root crops then consider some less common ones >yacon >oca >mashua >dahlia >burdock You would want one of the domesticated varieties of burdock if you're going that route. Depending on how your local wildlife is you also may have to occasionally rescue small birds from the seed heads. >southwest Are you in a low desert or high desert climate?
Low. So I've been looking at some more forgiving crops. The soil here is what I would call "halfway done" due to the chickens giving it a good workout and is very fertile. Just been looking at some crops I know do well in the heat.
>>40019 Are you in a dune region? Some of the Indians in the SW would plant desert adapted varieties of corn like a foot deep in sand dunes to protect the seed from over heating and the young plants from drying out. If not then you could try sunken planting beds, where you have little plots several inches deeper than the surrounding land that functions as a natural moisture trap.
>>40022 the soil has been amended to the point where it holds a lot of moisture, I really only need to set up a misting system during the high heat of the summer to prevent wilting on some types of crops, I have considered sunken but will probably go raised. I may do a combination of all types, sunken, raised, and one just in the regular ground and see which does best. I'm also considering experimenting because a lot of the documentation for this region is for large Ag, small casual gardens, and not the "long-term victory garden enthusiast" who wants sustainable food production year to year.
>>40028 Oh I just though of something. You were talking about using hydration beads from diapers earlier, you can buy dehydrated methylcellulose, under such names and crystal soil and soil moist, etc., and mix it into your soil. You'll want to work with the stuff while it's still dry though and it needs to be mixed well or otherwise you'll end up with what looks like a big pile of jellyfish vomit erupting from the ground.
Does anyone know about planting wheat? You can do it in the fall right?
>>40028 Look at permaculture and food forests/forest gardens. The idea being, you build up layers that support each other. If you layer right, moisture gets retained naturally and shade prevents harsh sun from damaging your more sensitive crops. In a forest, up to 7 layers from ground cover to large trees, but you can cut out some layers and still have success. Just a dwarf tree above the rest of your plants can provide enough shade to stop wilting. The two books "Edible Forest Gardens" have decent charts to see tree dimensions and shade strength. Generally speaking, perennial plants are more resistant than annual ones due to a larger root network too, so that might be worth a consideration.
>>40062 really good idea, thanks anon. I'll go pick some up. Planting season is soon, need to finalize what I am putting in. >>40158 winter wheat is supposed to be a forgiving crop from what I hear, it can be harvested at multiple times during growth so you can put it off for some reason and not panic. You could consider barley as well, but it requires some processing due to it's hull. But it is a delicious addition to soups, stews, side pilaf, etc.
>>40158 oh, and if you're cold and wet, consider rye. It loves "miserable weather"
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Friendly reminder that anon should be starting a compost pile. Even if you only garden flowers/non-edible plants compost is good to have. Throw your seaweed, egg shells, plant waste, etc. into it. Animal fur is rich in nitrogen and so long as you separate your primarily natural fiber clothes from your primarily synthetic fiber clothes, you can compost dryer lint (or use it as a fuel source) and such. Animal fur and feathers are also incredibly rich in nitrogen so when you brush your cat/dog or change your bird's bedding, you should add it to the mix. If you live somewhere sandy, a little clay (such as from cat litter) will help all the organic matter stick together so microbes can break it down into dirt. Arthropod/Mollusk/Crustacean shells are also an excellent addition to compost for nitrogen and calcium, but at bare minimum they need to be crushed up into fragments before adding to the soil or else they'll take years to break down (it's preferably to "cook" the shells at about 200 freedom for an hour or two to remove moisture and embrittle the chitin. Just make sure to properly "sterilize" things that can contain harmful microbes by baking them before adding to the compost, or keep two compost piles for edible plants and non-edible plants (then you can add macerated feces and urine to the non-edible plant compost pile too). You can add ashes/biochar to compost as well, but it is unironically better to urinate on ashes/biochar before adding them to compostable soil since it allows a more slow release of nutrients into the soil while speeding up the composting process. >But compost stinks It only stinks bad if you are adding a lot of fats/proteins into the soil such as beans and rice. It has a mild smell but putting a mesh chair or umbrella over the compost pile is usually enough to "trap" the smell with mild-smelling additions. Realistically you should be regularly adding urine to your compost so long as the smell isn't an issue since urine is an excellent source of nitrogen and phosphorus and can be used to make IEDs as well. Urine speeds up the composting process so you have useable soil quicker, and for some plants like sweet peppers and tomatoes it can double or quadruple your yield by mixing composted ash/urine mixture into the soil. Turns out plants are into golden showers. >Hormones and drugs in urine because of birth control and shit Funnily enough the temperatures that compost reaches are enough to deconstruct hormones and most pharmaceuticals so it's probably a non-issue outside of specific medications like those containing lithium.
Has anyone here ever kept pheasants for egg production?
>>42351 I can't imagine it would be a good idea. Unlike chickens, pheasants only lay eggs for about 2-3 weeks out of the year between April and June depending on the species. Even then they only lay a dozen or two dozen eggs. I've read a pheasant only broods once during the season. Sometimes she'll lay a second batch, but it wouldn't be very efficient as a food source since every egg eaten is one less pheasant you can eat later. You could breed pheasants much like chickens to one day produce eggs year-round, but it took the world about 600 years of breeding to turn chickens into a year-round egg-laying species.
>>42348 How does one properly store and transport compost discreetly around nosey concrete dwellers?
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>>42391 I just have a big 50lb plastic soil sack that I fill with compost when I'm getting ready to use it on things. My setup is that I have what looks like a resin barrel bush planter on my balcony with wet shredded paper mulch and baby grass/alfalfa/chia cover crop to hide it/mask the scent (those grow in basically any soil) and some thin slits cut into the sides with a spade to aerate it. Then I have an outdoor cloth chair over it to keep some of the rain off of it/make it blend in better. It also helps that my neighbor's dogs fucking reek when they piss outside so all the concrete dwellers focus on her instead of me.
>>17689 MY COMMENT: Things are about to get very ugly for the Western world, not just for Europe, Ukraine and Russia, but in America too. Everyone buckle up, get ready, be prepared. When the economy starts to tank and it will, you are going to start seeing massive price inflation with a MASSIVE MEDIA AND GOVERNMENTAL COVERUP, they'll lie and claim it's only 8% inflation when in reality it's 25% to 30% month to month. If you do not trust what I have to say it's your problem, not mine. I am here to warn you before it happens. Get food, get extra water, get extra clothing/boots/shoes, make sure you are armed, make sure you have a backup plan to keep warm during the winter (yes even without any electricity because the energy bills are going to be waaaay too expensive for most hard working people to afford in the coming few years, maybe longer). You are going to witness a full blown crisis in the coming year and it is going to shake things up significantly in the Western world so get prepared NOW! Do not, I repeat, do not fall for the wars between the Eastern and the Western world, do not get involved, bug out if you have to. Do not obey any emergency orders to evacuate your town or home. The wars are only meant for depopulation of the masses, and to cull, disarm and re-locate people to the cities which will be under Martial Law! All these wars are staged by governments to cull "undesirable excess" (aka YOU and YOUR FAMILY!) Do not fall for it, these corrupt governments are not worth dying for. Their agendas are not worth dying for. Prepare to survive what is coming if you really hate (((them))) as much as I do. Never forget what they have done to us. Never forget.
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What's a good (preferably discrete) way to kill squirrels when anti-coagulant bait didn't work and even shooting them with a BB gun will get the cops called on you by Karens/nasty letters from the HOA? >Just move out Not an option for at least 6 more months.
>>43171 >BB gun will get the cops called Slingshot? Cats can be effective as well.
>>42512 >Never forget what they have done to us. Never forget. Could you remind us?
>>43171 They make suppressors for air guns that I don't think are considered NFA items, if you live in the US. There are also ways to make wire snare traps set up at the base of the tree which can catch squirrels. Downside is you run the risk of catching pets or the neighbors seeing the dead body in the trap.
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JIM STONE COMMENTS: When the war ball gets rolling it will happen in a very short time. Right now the US is placing nukes in Asia and Europe. This is not a guess, it is on Drudge. While doing this, Russia is getting pestered. My guess is that Posiedon is already placed. Why wait? It is re-callable so why not position it in advance? So many people are dying from the vax now that war would be a great way to take the heat off. And a great way to steal an election and a great way to achieve 2025 population goals - are they going to give us a Halloween trick?. I doubt they have any treats. They are anxious, and it could all be over in a flash . . . . . Pennsylvania election official openly admits the next election will be stolen... stolen with as many mail in ballots as it takes because they received "threats". Listen to the leftist meta talk, anyone can translate leftie speak this basic: https://youtube.com/watch?v=2I7JSriM4p4 [Embed] Time to start logging the FRAUD: https://archive.ph/SQSs3 https://www.zerohedge.com/political/after-sending-out-240000-unverified-ballots-pennsylvania-now-warns-delays-counting https://archive.ph/ov8pg https://www.dailysignal.com/2022/10/26/lawmakers-want-to-know-why-pennsylvania-sent-out-240000-unverified-ballots/ MY COMMENT: We pretty much know where they are taking us, and by the way I do believe this is the same with the sudden mainstream announcement of them openly and brazenly creating bio-weapons in top universities too: THIS IS ALL A BUNCH OF OPEN DEATH THREATS TO AMERICA. "Do as we say or you all die" say the despotic demons who pose as Jews. Why else would this be happening? Regardless what happens, know this as fact and prepare accordingly, never die their pawns. I have a feeling if their house of cards falls, they'll take the world down with them. Can we really prevent it? God only knows but don't count on it.
>>43179 Chemtrails!!! GMO franken-foods with toxic glyphosate!!! Covid mRNA clot shot depop!!! Fluoride in all the tap water!!! Endless wars!!!! 9/11 false flag operation!!!! Mass warrantless spying!! 5G kill grid!!! Agenda 21 / Great Reset destabilization!!!! Open border destabilization and population replacement!!! Destruction of our currency via debt insolvency!!!! "Patriot Act" NDAA police state!!!
>>43195 Add in the promotion of mutilation of children's genitalia!! Mass propagandist lies 24/7 broadcasted on mainstream "corporate" media!!! Censorship!!! Witch hunts against political opposition!!! The murders of hundreds of holistic doctors!!!! Corruption of the Big Pharma & healthcare system!! Covid lockdowns that gutted the REAL economy, etc!!! Endless corruption mass murdering despots!!!
>>43190 Did he died?
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>>43171 Kill the Karens and the entire HOA, they're a bigger threat than squirrels anyway.
Osage orange bushes are growing alright. Had our first frost yesterday night so I left them in the snow (and sun) this morning to "deactivate" growth then brought them indoors and put them in a cool but sunny spot. They're all roughly 1-2 feet tall after a year of growing. Unfortunately these are a plant that seem to need a lot of vertical space so my foot-deep pots just aren't big enough and I had to use bamboo skewers + compostable twine to hold them upright. Got them on a regiment of plant feed stakes until next Spring when I can hopefully either get bigger pots for them or else find an outdoor spot to plant them in the ground. Of the 100 seeds I planted roughly 60 of them spawned, but I didn't have the space for 60 tree-sized bushes and had to cull their numbers down to about 25 plants. Of those 25 about 13 more had to be culled due to a heat wave killing them/stunting growth, and then 8 of the remaining 12 caught diseases after the squirrels dug up the root systems and died of disease or structural collapse. I wonder if any of the four remaining plants will actually manage to survive long enough to bare fruit so I can grow them in the far future? Meanwhile all my fucking bamboo never spawned. I know I could propagate from a "sapling" but I refuse to pay $200 for a sapling when seed is only $10. Edible plants did fine more or less and I enjoyed good (albeit small due to the two month heat wave) produce. I think I'll keep it simple and grow radishes next year since I had decent luck getting a couple small ones after planting a month late.
There seems to be a lot of confusion about what the Bible means when it speaks of clean and unclean foods.Clean and unclean food Put very simply, these are the Bible's dietary laws that if followed can lead to a long and healthy life. The question is: Can we trust the ancient words of the Bible? And what about modern science. Does it support or discredit God's dietary laws? I have found that there are many Christians today who are unaware that the Bible states that our bodies are not our own and that they were bought with a price which was the death of Christ. Scripture also informs us that it is our responsibility to look after these bodies that are on loan to us. But sadly, these are facts that many would rather not acknowledge. Most would rather the well known sea food diet, that is, everything and anything we see that appeals to our eyes and nose. Unfortunately, these are foods that are often very damaging to our bodies and result in us dying from cancer and heart attacks because of our love for food! Most people live to eat rather than eat to live as God intended. Note the following relevant scriptures. 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 “What? Know you not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which you have of God, and you are not your own? 20 For you are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.” And 1 Corinthians 10:31 “Whether therefore you eat, or drink, or whatsoever you do, do all to the glory of God.” Do we defile our bodies if we knowingly eat foods laced with chemicals that can make the body sick and die? Sadly, most of us do and without any fear of the following warning. 1 Corinthians 3:17 “If any man defiles the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.” It is easy to mock God's Word and say it has no relevance to our physical lives today. But it is amazing though, how very interested someone can become in what God has to say when lying on a deathbed because of a decadent lifestyle. Sadly, it is usually too late to effect changes in their lifestyle by that time. It is better to stay in denial, right? When we find ourselves lying in a hospital bed and dying, then we say, “I don't want to die! I better change to a healthy diet so I might live. Please someone, tell me what should I do and eat so that I can beat this illness and live?”Good Bible food God already told us what to eat when he gave us His dietary laws with clean foods and unclean foods, but most do not care to listen and mock God's instructions until they suddenly find themselves on their deathbed wondering how they got that way! If only we had listened in the first place. Here are some interesting points which show us what God's health plan for us is:
1. When God created Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden, He said to them: Genesis 1:29-30 “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be food for you. And to the BEASTS of the earth and all the BIRDS of the air and ALL THE CREATURES that move on the ground--everything that has the breath of life in it--I give EVERY GREEN PLANT for food. And it was so.” Seed-bearing plants include nuts, grains, legumes, and seeds. Our digestive tract is 12-14 times our shoulder to hip trunk length, the same as fruit eating animals. Herbivores (for example, cattle) have a digestive tract length of 20 times their body length. The shortest intestinal tracts are found in meat eating animals. When mankind left the Garden of Eden, vegetables were added to their diet. Genesis 3:18 tells us that the “plants of the field” were now to be considered as food. Interestingly, fruit can be eaten with nuts, grains and seeds without any ill effects, but if eaten with vegetables can lead to digestive problems. There is fermentation in the gut when fruit and vegetables are eaten together and this can lead to health problems. 2. The distinction between clean and unclean animals was known about in Noah’s day, long before God gave the health laws to the Jewish people: Genesis 7:2-3 “Of every CLEAN beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are NOT CLEAN by two, the male and his female. Of fowls also of the air by sevens, the male and the female.” 3. After the great Flood of Noah’s day, meat was permitted in the diet, however the blood was not to be eaten: Genesis 9:3-5 “Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant. Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood.” It is clear however that there was a distinction between clean and unclean animals. Unclean animals were not even considered as fit to eat. It is understood that only clean meats were to be used as food, as there were more of them in the ark. (Genesis 8:20 “Noah took of every clean beast and every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings.” If unclean meats were to be eaten and sacrificed, there would not be a pair of them left to propagate, to enable the command in verse 17: “Bring forth with thee every living thing that they may breed abundantly in the earth.”) 4. God clarified the differences between clean and unclean creatures, in Leviticus chapter 11: “Whatever divides a hoof, thus making SPLIT HOOVES AND CHEWS THE CUD, among the animals, that you may eat. …These you may eat, whatever is in the water: all that have FINS AND SCALES, those in the water, in the seas and in the rivers, you may eat…. These moreover, you shall detest among the birds; they are not to be eaten: the eagle, vulture, buzzard, kite, falcon, raven, ostrich, owl, seagull, hawk, pelican, vulture, stork, heron, hoopoe and the bat. …These you may eat among all the winged insects: those which have above their feet JOINTED LEGS with which to jump on the earth...” Professor Walter Veith is a doctor of Zoology with a research field in nutritional physiology. He reveals some very interesting things about unclean animals. The physiology of some birds, animals and fish is such that their flesh is not fit for consumption. This includes carnivorous birds without a crop, animals which don't chew cud or have a cloven (split) hoof, and fish without fins or scales. All animals which eat other animals are unclean. Camels have a high level of toxins in their bloodstream, caused by retaining their body fluids rather than sweating. Coneys have a poor thermo-regulator and their enzymes are unstable, resulting in intestinal fermentation. The meat is very acidic, predisposing to disease. Rabbits are coprophagous, meaning that they eat their own faeces, and the levels of toxins in their bodies are much higher than acceptable for human consumption. All rodents and the horse are the same. Pigs have very high histamine levels and sulphur content, leading to high blood acidity and osteoporosis in those who eat them. Pigs also have a high level of bacterial contamination of salmonella, other harmful bacteria and parasites. These are just a couple of brief points. Fish without fins and scales are either scavengers or carnivores and have a high level of toxins in their bodies. Urea in sharks and other fish gives these creatures a distinctive flavor but the flesh is not healthful in the diet. God has known these things from the beginning of time. Although we may not know all the reasons behind His commands, He knows what’s best for us. After all, He made us and He knows what we should put into our bodies. We are very particular as to what kind of fuel we put into our cars. Why aren't we more careful about what we put into our mouths? 5. Colossians 2:16 is often quoted but is often wrongly translated and very misunderstood. Modern Bibles mistranslated this passage as they did not understand Meat and Drink offerings were part of the ordinances, and so translated them as “food and drink.” There are no unclean drinks in the Bible, only unclean foods! These also had no relationship to the ordinances that were nailed to the cross, but the Meat and Drink offerings did. Thus the ordinances of Colossians 2:16 did have and must have all of the following, “Meat and Drink Offerings”, “Holy Feast days”, “New Moon festivals” and “ceremonial Sabbath days” such as Passover and others. Compare Ezekiel 45:17 and Colossians 2:16. It is easy to recognize WHICH law Colossians 2:14-16 is referring to. It is not the Ten Commandment Law (law of liberty, written with the finger of God on stone), which had nothing to do with meat and drink offerings, new moons, holy feast days and the ceremonial sacrificial Sabbaths. This passage also has nothing to do with health laws. It is obviously referring to the Mosaic Law, which was handwritten by Moses and could be “blotted out.” This was the only law with ordinances which pointed forward to the sacrifice of Jesus. These ordinances were no longer necessary when the real Passover Lamb was slain. Dietary laws are laws for health, not “ceremonial” or “ritualistic” laws, although they are mentioned in Leviticus. They are not therefore included when the Lord “nailed the handwriting of ordinances which was against us” to His cross. See Colossians 2:16 for more detail. 6. Regarding Mark 7:1-23 Mark’s statement that Jesus declared all foods “clean,” does not mean that He abolished the distinction between clean and unclean meats. (Unclean meats were not even regarded as “food”!) And the discussion between Jesus and the Pharisees and scribes had nothing to do with the KIND of food but with the MANNER in which the disciples ate. The Pharisees had man-made rules about washing of hands (beyond hygienic levels). The issue was whether or not ritualistic washing of hands before meals was necessary. Jesus said that what defiles a person is not the food eaten with ritually unwashed hands, but the wicked things from the heart, because the food “does not enter his heart but his stomach, and is eliminated”. Thus Jesus declared that all foods eaten with ritually unwashed hands are spiritually “clean” (Mark 7:19). The Greek word for food (bromata) here used, is the general term for food, referring to all types of food for human consumption, not just flesh foods. 7. Peter's vision in Acts 10 of the animals did not teach that unclean animals had become fit for food. If Jesus had previously authorized unclean animals for food, what was Peter doing refusing them at this late stage? Obviously Jesus had never done this. And the vision could not have been simply an instruction about clean VS unclean meats, for Peter was “greatly perplexed about the meaning of the vision.” He knew there was a deeper meaning to the vision. Peter quickly came to understand that the vision taught that GENTILES were not unclean, and that he could associate with them without becoming contaminated: Acts 10:28 “You know how unlawful it is for a Jewish man to keep company with, or go to one of another nation. But God has shown me that I should not call ANY MAN common or unclean” And by continuing to read, we come to a place where Peter tells the whole story, leaving no doubt that this was the real meaning of the vision. (Note, in Acts 11:2-18 that Peter says nothing about unclean foods now being acceptable to eat - because that had nothing to do with the vision). So here in the very next chapter we see that the vision was to tell Peter that the Gospel was now for the Gentiles as well. This was a very significant point in time. That is why angels and visions were employed to direct the early church. Now the Gospel was to go to the Gentiles and this of course was a very important direction.
8. In his letters to the Romans and Corinthians Paul addressed the implications for Christians of the widespread practice in the Gentile world of offering flesh foods to idols. The issue among the early Christians was not about eating meat as such, (there was never an issue about vegetarianism in the early Christian church), but about whether the eating of meat offered to idols was an act of worship. See 1 Corinthians 8 and 1 Corinthians 10:20-28. Those strong in their faith did not believe that eating meat offered to idols was an act of worship, and thus they would eat all (edible) things which had been offered to idols. Those who did not have such strong faith used only vegetables, which were not offered to idols. Paul urged: Romans 14:2 “Accept the one who is weak in faith, but not for the purpose of passing judgment on his opinions. One man has faith that he may eat all things, but he who is weak eats vegetables only.” Romans 14:20-21 “Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offence. It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine or to do anything by which your brother stumbles.” This was not a campaign for or against vegetarianism, for vegetarianism was not an issue at this time in history. Unless Paul is contradicting other New Testament scripture than he has to be referring to all clean meats being “clean,” which would have been a foregone conclusion in those days and not required clarification. We also have no other Scriptural evidence to indicate that unclean animals had been authorized for food. The latter would NOT have even been considered as edible, whether offered to idols or not. 9. In discussion of end time events, God still calls swine and mice, among other things, “detestable”: Isaiah 66:17 “… who eat SWINE'S FLESH, DETESTABLE THINGS, and mice, shall COME TO AN END altogether, declares the Lord” 10. Some are always bound to quote verses 4 and 5 of the passage 1 Timothy 4:1-5, saying that you can eat anything if “sanctified by the word of God and prayer.” But note the context which is found in verse 3 of this passage: “meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving.” God did not create unclean animals to be eaten by man and God would never sanctify something He explicitly condemns as an abomination. So what then is being referred to in the above passage? The answer is found in verses 1-3. The passage refers to “latter times” of a Church that “departs from the faith” and “speaks lies in hypocrisy that has their conscience seared with a hot iron” and that also “forbids to marry, and commands to abstain from certain meats on certain days.” So which Church forbids to marry and says you cannot eat certain foods on certain days? Not a difficult question. Thus this passage is not contradictory to the rest of God's Word and the author is actually saying that every clean creature is perfectly adapted and suitable to its intended purpose. The passage is not saying that everything created can be eaten! Who wants to argue that skunks, rats, mice, lizards and scorpions are good for food? And remember anon to drink semen, it's a great source of protein!
>unprovoked /christian/ schizo ramblings in a completely unrelated thread Truly the most cancerous board.
I read somewhere years ago that iron reinforces a plant's woody portions so I'm giving my osage orange bushes some iron, potassium, and magnesium supplements. Will post results if it kills the plants. One of the plants got minor frostbite before I decided it was too cold and brought it in (all the leafs died but I think the root system is still strong) so we'll see if it bounces back in the next couple weeks. It was the only plant I didn't treat with insecticide when bringing indoors since I left it out for a couple frosts to see how much these plants could handle.
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First year ever trying to garden something and it's turned out almost half-decent given the circumstances >bought seeds in mid-March for peas, peppers, bunching onion, and tomatoes >didn't know the peas needed something to grab onto to grow, so they'd fall over limp and try to grab onto something before giving up and dying >accidentally planted way too much bunching onion in one pot, probably a hundred or so sprouts that stopped growing after a certain point since there was nowhere left for the roots to go, removed most of them and cut them into small bits and left a few in the pot, these grew almost instantly into their full size. flavor was great, nice oniony taste. >peppers also turned out pretty well, didn't know that one plant would produce so many so I had quite a few peppers that I didn't know what to do with. mixed a bunch of them into my lunch one day along with cayenne pepper and chili powder, wanted to die for the next hour or so it was so spicy. still have a handful growing right now despite the cold weather. >tomatoes turned out quite sad, planted two seeds in one pot and let them both grow together. they also ran into the same problem as the peas since they needed something to latch onto, despite what the old lady at the hardware store said. found a piece of green rubber fencing, stuck a large stick and metal stake through it, and they grew up it quite nicely. later bought an actual tomato cage since they began to ourgrow that as well. took a really long fucking time to produce anything (two tiny fruits, one of which was molded), currently has 5 tomatoes on it right now, and despite it being in the mid-50s and the plants looking like pic related I am still waiting on those tomatoes to ripen. all in all a good learning experience. will wait until next June to plant something against since I'm planning moving soon. what should I try next time?
>>44080 >peppers You can always dry hot chili peppers for later use. Or were they sweet peppers? >tomatoes >moldy Blossom end rot, maybe. Tomatoes, peppers, eggplants, etc. can always benefit from calcium supplements. >what should I try next time? I would suggest trying either cherry tomatoes or current tomatoes or if you want big fruits maybe try determinate tomatoes. Depending on where you are, temperature and growing season wise, I always like to suggest amaranth as a crop. Radishes, mustards, and other greens can make good spring and fall crops too. And nothing is quite as rewarding as growing pumpkins, just stay away from maxmias if it's your first time due to the vine bored problem.

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