Replacing all conventional artillery with (guided) rocket arty. Could you actually do it?

>>5258 Why would do that when you can launch guided missiles from artillery tubes? With modern robotics you could up the RoF to the point it's nearly on par with a MRLS, and you'd still retain all the benefits of having a cannon that can fire a variety of dumb shells with acceptable accuracy.

>>5258 Isn't the weakness of rockets and missiles their vulnerability to other missiles? They can be detected by AA systems and even tank APS. Meanwhile solid artillery/tank shells cannot be stopped mid-flight due to their ridiculously high velocity and very small size.

>>5304 I could have sworn that I read something about modern AA systems that could also be used against conventional artillery, certainly doesn't seem far fetched considering modern visual and radar systems.

>>5368 They can be, but it's not as simple as one may think. CRAM systems are going for one of two types of kill: 1) Hard Kill via boring into the projectile and detonating the bursting charge/warhead early. or 2) Causing significant enough damage to the projectile to either damage its airframe or induce ballistic shock and throw its trajectory off the target. With Cruise Missiles and Rockets, both 1 and 2 are relatively easy to cause if the CRAM actually hits them, since Cruise Missiles and Rockets tend to be extremely thin-skinned and have massive warheads. However, with conventional artillery shells this is a lot harder to achieve - given the thickness of the shell wall required to not sympathetically detonate the busting charge with the propellant. Long story short, for a CRAM to knock out an artillery shell they have to hit the incoming projectile with a high percentage of its potential energy with several modifiers I cannot for the life of me remember. It's doable with mortars (at any range) and possible with howitzers and small naval rifles (127mm-155mm) at the end of their effective ranges, but you can forget about it for 'high velocity' field guns (including most tank cannon) or other artillery 203mm and larger.

>rim fire revolver with swappable barrels and cylinders like ruger single 6 and dan wesson revolvers >various .22s .17s whatever rim fire >nagant revolver style action for that cylinder to barrel seal >threaded barrel comes standard >raised sights or no sights just pic rail >.22 version used with colibris or other subsonic to create the greatest one handed rat blaster Probably only would appeal to a farmer with a rat problem who also wants to have fun, but not enough to warrant an exterminator or letting loose a bunch of dogs. Maybe a trapper but they probably won't need to worry about the noise a standard .22 and ammo would cause if at all. My particular dream though >at BBQ with friends >wave dicks about who's grill is better >moves onto BBQ guns >fags whip out stag handled 1911s or SAA clones >I end the conversation by quick drawing my revolver and quietly blasting a squirrel >only those who were looking at me noticed I popped a squirrel without disturbing the others with loud noise >add it's meat to my grill >only my BBQ gun can actively participate in the BBQing process

>>5304 Seems like a problem you can solve with a barrage of cheap unguided missiles running alongside it. Though at that point why bother with the guided ones?

>externally powered Hotchkiss revolving machine gun Rather self-explanatory: take the Hotchkiss revolving cannon, redesign it to for a rifle cartridge, and then add a belt-feeding device and an electric motor to it. The actual mechanism has significantly fewer parts inside than the Gatling, and a it wouldn't need a delinker: https://invidious.snopyta.org/watch?v=cQEs6i4fwLA A nice bonus is that the barrel is stationary in the moment of firing, therefore it should be relatively accurate. I think a version with just 3 barrels wouldn't be an overkill even for a tank or an IFV, and with an electric motor you could easily vary the rate-of-fire for your needs. >pseudo belt-fed sniper rifle Real super hyper elite snipers use their rifles as single-shot weapons, because keeping the ammunition in the magazine might change its temperature, thus affecting the ballistics. So make a a precision rifle with no magazine but a belt-feeding device specifically designed to be useful for single loading. You place a single cartridge where you'd place the first one of the belt, work the bolt, and now it's loaded. And you can place a second one in the belt-feeding device if you need an immediate follow-up shot for whatever reason. But if once in your lifetime you need to fire 5 or 10 or 20 or even more shots in quick succession with that rifle, then you can use a belt. Really, it's just an excuse to give snipers a single-shot rifle without actually giving them one.

>>5459 >take the Hotchkiss revolving cannon, redesign it to for a rifle cartridge >rifle cartridge Weak. Why not scale it up to Russian 57mm ammo like the S-60 AA gun uses?

>>5461 Why not make it fire the Schwerer Gustav's 80cm shells? Because I want something that would be actually practical, and a Hotchkiss is much better than this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rheinmetall_RMG_7.62

>>5463 What in the name of Werner Gruner is that shit? Do the barrels turn with each shot or something? More importantly, WHY? They could have used a fixed-barrel roller-delayed system like the MG45, SIG MG-710. or the HK51E and added a forced-air cooling mechanism in a permanent sleeve around the barrel like the Pencheng has.

>>6779 Diffrent strelok, but same feeling even though firearms are not my area of knowledge. that's like designing a blish lock system for your army because you can't produce lubricant but you capture half the enemy lubricant stock during a conflict anyways. Is blowfoward a viable option or a meme nowadays? Question. Why not just have a bullpup with an extremely long stroke piston action for cooling? >pic semi related >ТКБ-059, a fucking three barrel, fully automagic, 90 round (tripled so only 30 rounds per barrel) bullpup firearm in 7.62x39

>>6783 >forget to add pic like a monkey.

Even worse: it functions like an MG3, but there is a computer that automatically rotates to the next barrel after a few hundred shots.

>>6797 >Even worse: it functions like an MG3, but there is a computer >computer dear god, a fucking caveman with a stone will rule us all if we ever lose power, fuck this shit

>>6797 Wouldn't the more sensible idea to just let the fucking gunner rotate it? You save on weight too!

>>5459 The Hotchkiss action is inherently unsuited for high rates of fire, because it combines intermittent movement with a large number of delicate little gears and cams (look at this video and find me a single moving part that would survive 1000rpm). The intermittent barrel rotation would probably also screw with accuracy at high ROFs, since every time the rotation starts or stops you're going to create vibrations. The Gatling action doesn't really have that problem because the barrels are rotating at a constant rate. >>6797 >>6798 >>6799 It sort of makes sense for an RWS. The gunner can't do it by hand because that would defeat the purpose of an RWS, and once you've added the machinery to remotely swap barrels it's not a big leap to go from "swap barrels when the gunner presses a button" to "swap barrels when the thermometer on the active barrel reads X degrees".

>>6818 >It sort of makes sense for an RWS a lot of things make sense under certain circumstance but weapons in that role depending on electricity is just nuts. If WWI era engineers could find a MECHANICAL solution to synchronize a plane's machine guns with its propeller i demand that modern engineers can do better.

>>6824 Kraut logic would build a generator on top next

>>6829 probably a fan or a solar panel

>>6824 Does the movement require electricity too? what's the point of shooting and swapping barrels if you can't aim the thing?

>>5117 Combat mecha. It's fine if its used in combined arms doctrine, for example one walker and a large infantry escort or a mecha command unit, couple tanks and appropriate escorts. Equip with an antenna and the ability to stand tippy toes for a very large signal range, or crouch down and drive on feet-wheels for flat terrain to keep up with the tanks while the legs are used for swamps/mountains. I just want battle mechs because they are cool.

Posted in the tank/afv thread but it probably also belongs here as well. Russians have a class of what they call "electro-optical distruptors" AKA laser beam weaponry. Except they use it for jamming planes/electro-optical equipment and missles If you know your GRAU index 1 for radio and electronics equipment K for Air defense 1 for specific unit numbering 7 for unit revision number 1K17 Szhatie (compression) , predecssor is 1K11 Literally a fucking laser tank designed to jam eletro-optical missles like AGM-114 or just fry/blind infantry. Also capable of shooting down helos as it actually straight up melts the god damn frame in a test alongside shutting down electronics. Ruskies made claims that the system is used in the Tunguskas and the APS systems. >literally a buratino but with 12 large ass lasers instead of rockets >according to the ruskies it fucking melted a helo in testing > Regarding the lasers themselves, there are two versions : one each, specifically for "Compression" in the laboratory, a dozen 30-kilogram ruby ​​crystals were grown, on the other - not a ruby ​​laser, but the so-called Nd: YAG (solid-state laser based on yttrium aluminum garnet with additives of neodymium). Drawbacks were the slow fire rate, and energy consumption/ overheat issues. Fact they needed an additional fucking power plant in the thing lol. Regarding the 1K11 Stiletto : > A 1K11 laser and related equipment were installed on the chassis of the SU-100P self-propelled gun. The laser could work in a weak mode for targeting guided weapons and in a strong one - in this case, at a distance of about 5-7 kilometers (different data are given in the sources), the photocells of the optical systems and the transmitting tubes of television cameras were noticeably damaged . Under the appropriate confluence of circumstances, an enemy tanker, looking through an optical device, could receive a serious retinal burn. >All scraped >literally found in junkyards and a god damn ditch by explorers Sanguine vehicle (modified shilka), no GRAU index >On tests that began in 1983, the Sanguine showed that it can not only determine the optical system of an air target, but also successfully hit it . At the same time, at ranges over 10 km, the target optics were "blinded" for several minutes, and at distances of 8-10 km, the destruction of the sensitive elements of the optics had already begun. There is no exact data on the number of released "Sanguins" (classified), but at least one copy was made. Modified Il-76MD with large ass laser used for fucking over missles in picture too. GRAU Index 1A/ 1A2, possible third aircraft >The main laser was placed in the cargo hold, between the wing and the keel. To prevent it from interfering with aerodynamics in flight, the corresponding section of the aircraft's "back" was replaced with opening flaps: they opened, the laser moved out, and the ambassador of the work was retracted. The laser of the A-60 complex had a gas-dynamic scheme and carbon dioxide as an active medium. The radiation power exceeded 2 MW . The details of the tests over 30 years have not been published. Soviet Skif-DM project >space based satellite laser prototype >lost because couldn't achieve stable orbit >no actual (known) photos exist

This might be some top tier autism from centuries ago.

>>6818 I gave quite a lot of thought to it, and this is what I came up with. Apologies for the low quality, but in my current situation making this was literally faster than firing up a program to make some better sketches, and it's not like the idea warrants anything more. The strength of the Hotchkiss system is in the loading and locking, so that's what I want to keep. >Gear #1 is directly connected to the barrel cluster >Gear #2 is connected (either directly or via a gear train) to Gear #1 and the pseudo bolt (via the connecting rod) >said pseudo bolt loads one barrel, fires the next one and ejects a third one in a single motion (let's assume it has 5 barrels at the very least) >loading works like on the Hotchkiss, the curved locking plate guides the cartridge >said rammer also actuates the belt-feeding mechanism >firing pin is stupid simple (it should be easily replaceable, of course) >extractor connects with the rim of the empty case for a moment, then it starts pulling out the case as the barrels rotate and the pseudo bolt is travelling backward (hence the curved shape) >then a simple pathway guides the spent casing to the ejection port where a fixed ejector is waiting for it I can see two potential problems through: >extraction The extractor might need two sections to work, one of them can move so that it can snap onto the rim of the cartridge, then it's followed by a fixed part that does the pulling out. I'm just not sure about tolerances and wear-and-tear, so maybe this wouldn't be that simple in practice. Still, if it fails then there is still the option to give every barrel its own ejector instead (loosely inspired by what you can find on single shot and break action rifles). >gear rations I just go ahead and admit that I don't know much about gears, so I fear that gear #1 would have to be gigantic to keep the ration required for it to rotate only 1/5 of a turn while gear #2 completes a full rotation. If all of this works out somehow, then I think the best way to give it a spin would be to integrate gear #2 with a programmable stepper motor, so that you can freely vary the RoF. Also, at high RoF it would just spin the system like in the Gatling, but at low RoF (or single shot) it could be programmed to stop after every single shot for a fraction of a moment, so that the projectile has time to leave the barrel. The only additional trick is that the belt-feeding mechanism would need a disconnector, so when firing is stopped gear #2 rotates one more to clear the loaded barrel, but without chambering a fresh cartridge in its place. This system then could be also used for single shot. >>6798 >>6799 >>6824 We went over this before: >The best tank is a steel shed with an infantry platoon inside that has firing ports looking at every direction, because it has no machinery that could break and there are lots of eyes inside. Using a gun that needs electricity in a remote-controlled mounting that wouldn't work without electricity in the first place and was never designed to be operated manually is not a problem.. The real problem here is that the krauts did the very kraut thing of overcomplicating the solution: instead of adding some fins for forced-air cooling or going back to the good ol' water jacket they created this monstrosity that is so complicated that replacing it with a Maxim would be a step towards simplicity, and you wouldn't lose any additional capabilities. Yet it's fine by me, because I can point at it and use it as an excuse to argue for my deranged fantasy of arming every vehicle with rotary machine guns that have variable RoF.

I've always had a stupid idea in my mind since I was young of a pistol that holds a single .50 round. I feel like someone would've at least made a prototype of it by now.

>>6783 >Is blowfoward a viable option or a meme nowadays? It's simply useless for small arms, and there is no reason to use it on bigger weapons, because there is a plethora of better systems. >Why not just have a bullpup with an extremely long stroke piston action for cooling? How would that help with cooling, other than reducing the RoF? But if you want that then you have many other options besides a long piston. I honestly believe that long recoil is the answer to most questions regarding small arms, because it inherently forces a low RoF and the whole action becomes one big recoil absorber.

>>7136 I am fairly certain at least one huemonkey has nigger rigged something like that.

>>7006 Badass technikal story anon thanks for sharing >tfw future troops will have to wear goggles for wavelength protection or the retina snipers burn your corneas out on the note of lasers there were 3 special ops helicopter goons who got their corneas and nerves damaged in an alleged laser attack by a russian spy ice breaker back in 2010 something when they were examining the icebreaker and its antennas, russians didnt like that all that well so they decided to laze em, somehow the pilot was the only one that didnt get perment effects, those 3 guys suffer excruciating permanent pains and vision problems because of what happened, US ZOG gov rejwcted them completely and even called them crazy which Kinda supports the idea that they are taking laser weapons seriously, especially as a clandestine weapon sice they dint want to get the word out, and were even scummy enough not to silence their golems with at least some money. \ Laser weapons is the future?

>>7156 Short range lasers for electro-optical jamming/ APS systems might be feasible, soviets concluded that long range/ laser weaponry capable of downing an aircraft is not. DOD is moving in the wrong direction because muh shrekels. I have an autistic idea for a firearm. Why not get a side mounted magazine so you have a lower profile? Would it be possible to make it feed from either side and eject out the other port? obviously this is not a muh-average-infantry man weapon, more like some sort of semi-auto marksmanship rifle

>>7260 >DOD is moving in the wrong direction because muh shrekels. On the contrary, the US DoD actually managed to make Long Range Lasers work. MIRACL, for example, successfully hit the satellite MSTI-3 at a range of 268mi/432km and blew a hole in the 'wing' fixture, however it suffered damage from improper mounting (the same flaw that caused it to miss the center of target) and was disabled from the firing. It was repaired within the hour.

>>7264 Okay. I take that back then. So they finally solved dispersion and power source issues?

>>7269 Purportedly. While I admit that Laser Systems are not my area at all, I'm more familiar with the Solid State Laser systems than I am the older Chemical Lasers. They claim to have a special lens of classified composition that cuts energy dispersion to a small portion of natural, but I don't know the specifics. All I know is various range envelopes and system footprints for installing the systems onto ships, with ~250mi being considered the outer range of effect for the turret-sized arrays.

>>7276 Still has powerplant issues methinks then. Like dispersion is a hard problem like bullet drift. I suspect that also weather conditions can and still fuck over lazor effectiveness. Imagine invading china and the chinks just callup a pollution storm and it shuts down all your fancy lasers lol.

>>7288 >powerplant Powerplant is as simple as hauling more gensets around. For a mobile system, long range lasers are basically completely impractical, but it's fully possible for bases. Intermediate Ranged HELs could be powered by as few as 3 trailer gensets, which is simple enough to accommodate considering they'd be replacing the same number of 'ammo haulers' for conventional systems such as Patriot. And of course, for the CIWS/CRAM sized units, the genset is part of the firing vehicle, so they only need fuel trucks and actually can be part of mobile units. All that being said, on fixed bases or ships, powerplant becomes a non-issue since they generally have tens of megawatts of power available. >dispersion From my understanding, the US is currently treating the laser energy dispersion as the spread from a shotgun - more of a benefit than anything, even if it reduces effective range. If you can apply the raw power required to saturate the entire area, then it makes actually hitting the thing you're aiming at much easier and completely invalidates most of the commonly proposed countermeasures to lasers (such as speed-induced plasma barriers and rotation). That, of course, requires massive gensets and limits your effective range (or increases required dwell time), but the logic has its merits as a medium range defensive weapon at least. Unlike 'do fucking everything' multirole jet. >weather conditions Weather conditions are actually a massively overblown 'problem' that doesn't really affect HELs, since things such as dust, water vapor/spray, and such have such a low energy saturation limit that they are basically disintegrated/evaporated by the laser within milliseconds of exposure. The important thing is the frequency and wavelength of your radiation, same as for underwater use. Speaking of which, they (NorGru and LockMart both) apparently actually have HEL prototypes which work underwater - certainly, their maximum effective ranges are terribly short if you're comparing to open-air systems, but the concept of a 1.3km anti-torpedo system (that also functions as a silent sonar replacement for littoral navigational purposes and mine-detection) is attractive.

>>7290 >powerplant solutiosn Considering the ruskies did shove a powerplant into a mista-s chassis, I think it's not impossible. Would be interesting to see a US version of an eletro-optical jammer thats on a humvee dedicated to jamming missles like the 9K121 Vikhr or ERYX. There's rumors the russians adapted a smaller system on the tunguska and then made it into the APS systems on the T-90 and T-14. I wonder about issues with the lasers in divergence zones. Given water diffraction (is that the correct word) is larger than air, a SSP with a layer and a extremely different thermocline might be an issue if your in a surface duct.

>>7260 >I have an autistic idea for a firearm. Obviously: you're here. >Why not get a side mounted magazine so you have a lower profile? Like say, the Sterling SMG, or the FG-42? >Would it be possible to make it feed from either side and eject out the other port? Almost certainly, there's at least two ways I can think of to do that.

I've said this before. A balanced action (AK-107 clone) rifle chambered in 6.5 creedmoor. >Why? I thought of 3 reasons. First, the whole point of a rifle is to be easy to use for the average retard grunt. The main problem with retard grunts is their trash recoil control and therefore total inability to hit targets. The slav wizard action manages to fix this issue by turning their rifle into airsoft guns recoil-wise. Secondly, most of us can agree that 5,56 is a pussy round that is not suited for anything other than room cleaning. We also know that the 7,62 NATO that so many rifles are chambered in is great, but is too difficult for the average retard to control in anything other than semi. So, why not chamber a round like the 6.5CM which has significantly less recoil than 7,62 and better ballistic performance? It's better than 6.5 grendel too for obvious reasons. And finally, because it would be fucking RAD

How's this for an "ideal" universal military smallarms cartridge - base it on the 7.62x51mm NATO, but shorten it to a 40mm case length and neck it down to 6.5mm, using a bullet of about 130gr. You get something between the 6.5 Grendel and the 6.5x47 Lapua. Can run it through an M240 and you'd only need to swap out the barrel and maybe the feed tray. It'd be easy to manufacture an AR type weapon for it , something halfway between an AR-10 and and AR-15 (call it the AR-12.5?) Thoughts?

>>7370 > base it on the 7.62x51mm NATO, but shorten it to a 40mm case length and neck it down to 6.5mm, using a bullet of about 130gr. Instead of going through all this autism just use 6.5 CM

>>7369 As far as I know, balanced action only really works in full auto, and you shouldn't want your grunts to use it nilly-willy. Besides, if you want to lessen felt recoil, then you should use a spring-loaded stock, like what the FG-42 had. >>7370 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.5mm_Creedmoor >Parent case .30 TC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.30_TC >The .30 Thompson Center, also known by its abbreviated name, .30 TC is a cartridge developed for Thompson Center Arms by Hornady[1] Intended to deliver .30-06 Springfield performance in a .308 Winchester length round. >As it has been understood that gunpowder burns more efficiently in shorter wide-diameter casings,[5] modern ammunition has changed over time to become shorter and wider than previous cartridges. Besides, the difference is small enough that chambering it in a belt-fed 7.62mm NATO machine gun shouldn't be much of a problem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mk_48_machine_gun#Variants >At the National Defense Industry Association’s annual Special Operations Forces Industry Conference (SOFIC), which began on May 20 2019, FN has unveiled a prototype of its new Mk 48 Mod 2 machine gun chambered for 6.5mm Creedmoor. It was developed in response to a USSOCOM requirement. American special operations forces are interested in acquiring a lightweight belt-fed "assault" machine gun, which would offer better range than existing weapons.

>>7372 >>7375 The idea behind >>7370 was to have a case with a preexisting base diameter, but of roughly 5.56 length, without losing too much effective range compared to either 5.56 or 7.62. 6.5Cm extends the effective range past 7.62, but fails in the other parameters I just mentioned. My round is almost a shortened 6.5Cm, in dimensions. With good modern propellants, it should provide ~85% of the ballistics, with less cartridge weight, bore erosion, and recoil.

>>7396 But why? It's still going to be more comparable to 7.62 NATO in weight and size than to 5.56, and although I'm not a fan of the latter, even I have to admit the advantages of its small size and low mass.

>>7396 The cartridge you are looking for already exists; It's known as 6.5 Benchrest (6.5 BR). It's in the domain of wildcats for metallic silhouette shooters. It's based off of the .308 x 1.5" Barnes (7.62 x 39mm nato style) cartridge which is what all benchrest cartridges are based off of. Contrasting with the ppc cartridges that are based off of the .220 Russian. Both ppc and BR cartridges are well renowned for their inherent accuracy, and powder efficiency. It can push a 120 grain bullet to ~2500 fps out of a 14" barrel going by the hottest loading. Here's some load data with velocities: https://loaddata.com/Cartridge/65-BR-Remington-65mm-BR-Remington-Handgun-Using-Nosler-Bullets/3071 Here's load data for a rifle, most likely with a 26" barrel. It can push a 127 grain bullet to ~2700 fps. A 20" barrel could probably push a 120 grain bullet to ~2650 fps. https://loaddata.com/Cartridge/65-BR-Remington-65mm-BR-Remington/555

I have an idea for some alt-history: >during ww1 the US not just strongly considers adopting .303 British, but actually goes ahead and does it >after ww1 the French come to the conclusion that developing their own special cartridge is a waste of time when they have all these guns chambered for 8mm Mauser >in the 1930s, Japan (instead of developing both rimless and semi-rimmed .303 British) decides to adapt 8mm Mauser, because they have to manufacture it for the Chinese front anyway >during ww2 Britain adopts that Czech 8mm machine gun for the tanks, but then it leads for a push to adopt 8mm Mauser on a wider scale What would happen after the war in a world filled with 8mm Mauser, .303 British and 7.62x54 Russian?

>>7398 Range, and more importantly, power at range, while still being a controllable round for the usual sort of absolute moron who always ends wheedling their way into in the military in peacetime. >>7413 Well, I'll be.... is there anything other than bolt-actions chambered for it?

>>7520 >Well, I'll be.... is there anything other than bolt-actions chambered for it? No. This is a highly custom, for the lack of a better word, cartridge. Reamers, head spacing, the distance the bullet 'jumps' to the rifling, are all slightly different for each rifle. Everything done for the sake of performance. The people that use this cartridge simply have no reason to want a semi-auto in the cartridge. I know the PPC cartridges can be put into a standard AR-15 using a grendel bolt, as 6.5 grendel is just a slightly modified 6.5 ppc. But a semi-auto rifle in the benchrest cartridges will be a custom affair. If you wanted to build one your best bet will be to modify an AR-10. I really wish manufacturers put out more rifles in the PPC and BR cartridge lines, they are excellent performers.

>>7550 6.5 BR uses .308 as its parent. You'd need to modify some magazines, get a barrel and a standard .308 bolt face. Infact I believe people have already done it.

>>7442 >303 british spam cans for .08 cents/rd cool