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The claims about the formation of the faith of Abraham Anonymous 06/20/2022 (Mon) 20:37:38 No.13126
I have heard multiple claims about the formation of our scripture, such as >Exodus didn't happen >There was no Conquest of Canaan >Israelites were originally canaanites who broke off after the bronze age collapse >They worshiped the canaanite pantheon before a refugee group from egypt gave them the cult of Yahweh >They were roaming farmers who got into "sporadic conflict" with other ethnic groups >Moses didn't exist >Most of the OT was written in the 6th century BC, when Persians from the Zoroastrian religion gave them ideas for their faith, such as the idea of messiahs, heaven and hell, angels, armageddon, etc. among other things, thoughts?
fake and gay
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>>13131 >the Romans named the sabbath Saturday therefore Yahweh must be Saturn thats basically the kind of logic we're up against.
Satan's lies?
>>13133 This
>>13126 Actually, I'll help, I've got a few ideas of my own. >Israelites were originally canaanites who broke off after the bronze age collapse Even in the reports by the archaeologist ((Israel Finkelstein)) he has to admit that if the israelites were a slave caste to the original canaanites, he has to admit they were their own separate ethnic entity. Also, why would there be a genocide narrative in the OT? >Canaanite Pantheon was still worshipped It would be good to mention that "Elohim" and "Baal" are used as catch-all terms for "gods" or "God" all throughout the ancient Levant, plus, El, the supreme god of the canaanite pantheon, had a council of gods and demigods, does this show up in any of the ancient Israelite text? >Hyksos gave them the cult of yahweh Didn't Egypt have a polytheistic religion, how would they have developed this? >Shasu gave them the cult of yahweh Don't know about this one Maybe later, I'll go into it more
>>13126 >Moses didn't exist I actually have a source from an Arabic I think excavation where they found proof that the plagues of Egypt actually did happen. Give me some time to dig it up
>>13150 I recall it being discovered that there is a line or chariots across the bottom of the Red Sea.
>>13150 Interesting, please share
>>13126 Who are making these claims and what are the actual claims being made? It's hard to respond to a second hand summary like this. >They were roaming farmers who got into "sporadic conflict" with other ethnic groups I think it's pretty obvious from reading Genesis that Abraham and Lot were nomadic pastoralists. It's highly likely that this would have continued to be a strong part of their descendants' lives in subsequent generations. I have no idea why this is an argument against the Bible or Christianity. >Exodus didn't happen >There was no Conquest of Canaan >Moses didn't exist Literally just "No." until we see more of their argument. These can't be replied to because there is nothing to reply to. >Israelites were originally canaanites who broke off after the bronze age collapse >They worshiped the canaanite pantheon before a refugee group from egypt gave them the cult of Yahweh How does this square with the "there was no exodus/conquest" claims? Anyway the precise origins of the Israelite ethnos are to the best of my recollection obscure in archaeology. This may be true or it may not be but it also probably doesn't mean what you think it means. Again we need to see someone making this argument. Also remember that the Israelites in the Bible constantly went after worship of idols so the presence of such cultic items is hardly conclusive of anything.
>>13190 The claims are being made by actual archaeologists. They claim that the conquest of Canaan was actually them emerging from Canaanites after the bronze age collapse as a semi nomadic people, still worshiping El as their god, before being given Yahweh by the Shasu people. At least, this is the narrative given by "scholarly" sources, judging by things like how in Egyptian hieroglyphs the Israelites dressed and groomed similarly to Canaanites. Personally, I'm of the belief that the Israelites were the Shasu. I'll also stress, since the archaeological record is so mysterious, a lot of information is highly speculatory.
>>13214 it would make sense that the Israelites and Canaanites dressed similarly since they came from a similar area
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>>13126 I typically don't waste my time with those people. We've found the rock in horeb, the red sea crossing, biblical mt sinai, where israel worshipped the calf, and I'm sure there's more but that's just off the top of my head. Secularists and antichrists have endless "theories" to explain everything in any manner that doesn't validate the Bible, or rather that invalidates it. They'll believe in any manner of thing so long as it doesn't validate the Bible. No amount of reasoning or real world evidence is going to change their minds, same with the people who think your pic is actually God and who repost it all over the place to "own the Christians".
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>>13126 Great stuff, everyone, however the Zoroastrian stuff remains up in the air. Then again, why would they copy Zoroastrianism word for word but still "keep" the old mosaic law and rituals, instead of just wholly converting. It's not like the Persians liked the Israelites in any way whatsoever. Now, I would say the conversation would shift to Christ himself, as it is said that his birth was wholly fabricated from both Egyptian and Zoroastrianism and in reality, he was a zealot revolutionary.
>>13456 most of what is claimed to come from zoroastrianism is from the truth, with zoroastrian sources copying it.
>>14338 Gentile prophets exist, jewish rat.
>>14417 Even if true that doesn't change that Christian sources are older than zoroastrian ones my millennia minimum

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